Daily Roundup 2.27.07
Posted on Tuesday, February 27th, 2007 at 10:14 am by Xteve
Way to win one for Spencer (and DJ). Nice night last night on the court.
Details of the Portland blowout. Rashard was flat out unstoppable last night.
Forehead Ted takes a piece out of Dave Boling’s book and writes another glossy Nate McMillan story.
Here’s the arena drawings from the Times. Brian may write up a live from the scene update at some point. On paper looks good. Not crazy about the not paying for cost overruns statement, and that’s all I’ll say at this point.
I have a real problem with stories like this … where were the stories on Howard Schultz’s political views? How about Paul Allen’s? Would conservatives have a problem with Schultz’s company offering benefits to same sex partners? This smells like a carefully leaked hack job, seriously. Seattle, you should be f*cking ashamed of yourself and in case anyone wonders I’m fairly left leaning politically speaking. If we checked political donations of every millionaire in this town I guarantee you we could all find something controversial there to either the right or left. Rich people are by nature conservative, to pretend otherwise is naivete. I didn’t realize that to operate a business in Seattle you had to espouse liberal views and I propose that the Seattle media have the guts to do the same digging on Hawks and Mariners ownership. Does Hiroshi Yamauchi support whaling? Even if Bennett’s group caved on this they’d be taken to task for not being vegetarians or something else.
GWs review and Clippers up next
Who was this mysterious tipster? I wonder …
After introductions of Wilkens, Gus Williams, Fred Brown, McMillan and Jack Sikma, Haywood gave a somewhat rambling speech that concluded with him saying, “This was my original home. This will always be my first home. Don’t let the Sonics leave town. Whatever you do, it is very important to not let them leave town. We didn’t have anything here when we all came. We were the only thing in town. A lot of you all came to live here because you saw the Sonics on TV.”
“The difference in my year (that Allen was a free agent) is that there weren’t really any teams with money,” Allen said. “Cleveland, but Cleveland was never really in it. Orlando is a viable option (for Lewis) because there are some good young players and their season is not over yet. I think if they are close (to competing), they are going to make a push for Rashard.
“The onus is … on this organization, really – what we do as a team to really put on a good face and prove to Rashard that this is going to be a formidable team in the future.”
And my favorite local hoops blogger Mike Seely:
And yet, Haywood only played five seasons in green and gold, which forces us to consider a couple other Sonic 24’s: DJ and Tom Chambers. Johnson was MVP of the Supes’ lone championship team. Chambers, like Haywood, spent five years with the Sonics, finishing with just 103 career points less than his jersey-mate, and was MVP of the 1987 All-Star Game at the Kingdome, widely considered to be the greatest of all-time. Look, I’m thrilled that the Sonics honored Haywood, but I wonder now how low the bar is for future rafter-raisings.
I get his point. However there is no doubt which number needs to go up there next and that’s #20. The problem with the Sonics isn’t so much which numbers they retire but it’s the timing. I still don’t get why DJ’s number was never retired, or Spencer’s for that matter … but Nate’s went up virtually the day after he retired and while he was still an employee??? With regards to DJ, does this town and/or organization hold onto past beefs that long? If so that’s a more telling commentary on the sports fans of this city than those athletes. If they retired Chamber’s number, then why not the X-Man, who IMO is more well remembered and regarded around town? or Dale Ellis, who played more games as a Sonic than either X or TC?
February 27th, 2007 at 10:49 am
This smells like a carefully leaked hack job, seriously. Seattle, you should be f*cking ashamed of yourself and in case anyone wonders I’m fairly left leaning politically speaking.
- Can’t agree with you more on this…
February 27th, 2007 at 10:51 am
Guys, I don’t think it’s a political issue. It’s a marketing one. These guys bought a team with a huge gay fan base, and they are bankrolling an anti-gay-rights organization? I don’t know how you explain that to Storm fans.
February 27th, 2007 at 10:54 am
So how does this quote:
“There is no economic justification for this at the state level,” Hunter said. “The decision is, do people want to have professional basketball in the Seattle area and are they willing to pay taxes for it? I personally am pretty skeptical about it.”
and this quote:
The taxes include a portion of the retail sales tax as well as taxes on restaurant meals, car rentals and hotels in King County.
belong in the same article?? good to know that the people of Spokane aren’t going to benefit from the Arena. I guess it is also good to know that they won’t be paying for it…
Also, I’m beginning to hate, hate, hate this quote:
Those taxes would raise an estimated $1.1 billion between 2012 and 2032, according to estimates by legislative staff.
almost as much as I hate the “taking money from education” quotes. If you are going to write this sentence you should have to write after that “…however, the $1.1 billion would not be available if not used for the arena since most of the taxes will expire”
February 27th, 2007 at 11:02 am
The Stranger can post about what they want. They preach to the choir. But the PI and Times need to shut up and not make something out of nothing. It will be totally tragic if mainstream media hype was the deciding factor in running the team out of town.
February 27th, 2007 at 11:20 am
- I mean personally I think George Bush and many of the things he does are idiotic. Now, I would imagine that many of the owners of the Sonics are Bush supporters. Does that mean I am not supposed to follow my team anymore??
February 27th, 2007 at 11:35 am
I don’t know why I do it, but I need to stop reading the rantings on the PI SoundOff board. It is so frustrating to hear what kind of ignorance gets spewed. It just makes my blood boil!!!!
So how was the turnout at the hearing last night? It sounded as it went well when I listened online.
February 27th, 2007 at 11:53 am
If Bill Gates or Paul Allen or Jeff Bezos buys a company or wants to open a distribution center or other workplace in a red state do any of you really think the media in say, Dallas for example, would rake them over the coals for supporting cause X or Y or do they welcome the community investment? Apart from being the kind of juvenile crap that gives the “liberal media” epithet legs, it’s a jaw-droppingly ugly display of provincial attitude that solves nothing and likely discourages further investment in the region.
I don’t see anyone in Seattle lamenting the selling of Boeing aircraft to Chinese airlines even though China is a documented oppressor of human rights, freedom of speech and many other values that Seattlites hold dear. Nobody talks about the outsourcing of Microsoft tech support or other departments … it’s just hypocritical in the extreme for people to even go down that road.
February 27th, 2007 at 11:57 am
Yeah its pretty sad they have to bring in the anti-gay bit. It seems like this town is trying all they could to kick the sonics out.
btw that new building looks sick.
Not as sick as Livingston dislocating his knee though.
watch this
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2781003
GOOD GOD… That looked nasty, I’m surprised he didn’t tear every single ligament in his knee.
February 27th, 2007 at 12:10 pm
Hey Brian & Everyone who went down last night to OlyWA: Thanks and nice showing! I heard on KJR after the game that SOS&S had 35 people there to support the arena plan, while opposition had 1.
For those of us that couldn’t make the trip, we appreciate it!!
February 27th, 2007 at 12:23 pm
This is just more of these guys getting KILLLED in the PR battle. It’s laughable how bad of a job they’re doing with the public at this point.
I want this arena built.
The majority of the public does not.
That majority is opposed because they don’t appear to know what the hell they’re talking about but they’re opposed nonetheless. It is the team’s job to try and educate them and to generate some public backing. I’ve seen nothing happening.
If I was in the legislature and 2/3 of the public opposed a measure, even if I personally thought the proposal was positive, you better believe I’ll have reservations before saying yes. Hopefully, I would still say yes but I’d have a damn good reason to say no as well.
February 27th, 2007 at 12:25 pm
I’m simply too busy right now to make a long statement about last night but I want to say thank you to those who showed up.
In the testimonial volunteers we had a 36 to 1 ratio of Pro’s to Con’s with Chris VanDyke being the only Con. While almost nobody got a chance to speak(I was thrown off greatly by Ross Hunter and his damn stopwatch) our presence was felt and based on the correspondence I am getting it was extremely impactful.
I’ve been getting frustrated in this process and one of the most rewarding parts of last night was that nobody, not a single dang person came in just for the tickets. Most of them took them but several laughed about how they’d given away 2 tickets to last nights game in order to attend and several just didn’t need them being season ticket holders alread. People brought their own stories and their own passion and it rubbed off on me. Very revitalizing.
THANKS!
February 27th, 2007 at 12:29 pm
Brian,
You interested in seeing any of the correspondence we are getting back from various Senators we’ve been writing? I received a reply from Mr. Pridemore yesterday. I figured I’d keep emailing him after the response he sent to another poster on here that was pretty negative, hoping I could sway him our direction a bit.
February 27th, 2007 at 12:39 pm
“I have a real problem with stories like this … where were the stories on Howard Schultz’s political views? How about Paul Allen’s? Would conservatives have a problem with Schultz’s company offering benefits to same sex partners? This smells like a carefully leaked hack job, seriously”
I agree 100%. It’s irrelevant IMO (although I do understand the Storm have a large gay following, I doubt most of those fans would encourage NOT getting an arena done so the Storm can leave to OKC over a social issue & political donations). Also, it really bugs me that this story has been spoken in the same sentence as the Tim Hardaway comments….saying one “hates” a group of people is much different than a rich guy with likely Christian values who is donating money because he wants to conserve the sanctity of marriage. It’s not a “hate” crime to do that. Anyways, it’s a bias that is quite annoying.
February 27th, 2007 at 12:41 pm
I received an unfortunate reply from Ruth Kagi, 32nd District.
I did write back to her thanking her for her response and stated that this is important enough to me that should she vote no on funding and should the team leave the area, that I would do everything in my power to help her opponent at the next election, whomever it is, to defeat her.
I’ve never been a single issue voter but I will be on this matter.
February 27th, 2007 at 1:14 pm
“I have a real problem with stories like this”
Thank you. That completely chapped my hide when I heard it this morning. I couldn’t agree with you more.
February 27th, 2007 at 1:15 pm
Seriously, does the Professional Basketball Club even have a PR firm?
If they do, they need to be fired, quick.
I think that the thing people are missing in this whole debate is the cultural value of the team. I don’t see this as being any different than a new art museum or the sculpture park or a cinvention center. Calling the sonics “private enterprise” is a little misleading.
February 27th, 2007 at 1:36 pm
I still wonder why Jim Kneeland keeps his contact info private because if he was open to our suggestions things could improve a lot in this process.
February 27th, 2007 at 3:37 pm
Does Chris McGann really consider himself a journalist? That might be one of the most ridiculous articles I’ve ever read. I haven’t seen this much Spin Doctoring since “Pocket Full of Kryptonite.
I’m surprised he didn’t try to get a quote from John Amaechi. Actually he probably did. Amaechi could have been quoted saying “How is that relevent?”.
McGann: “Thanks for your time John”.
I just like to think that most people have the common sense to see through articles like this.
Next thing you know the Sonics will be anti PETA/animals, because we continue to use the old new leather ball. They can throw in a line about us at one time considering the acquisition of Qyntel Woods, and how one of Bennett’s conpanies uses guard dogs.
February 27th, 2007 at 3:41 pm
I wrote a letter to McGann telling him it was a shameful piece of journalism, that there was no point in writing it unless he was trying to push his either his PC-agenda or his anti-arena agenda.
February 27th, 2007 at 4:19 pm
The simple fact that no reporting of this kind was done when either the Hawks or Mariners changed hands is proof positive that is a poorly disguised slander piece.
Major jeers to Chris McGann for not being smart enough to recognize spin not to mention writing a blatantly misleading lead implying that there was purposeful deception going on, and major jeers to the P-I for publishing it.
Sadly it is not difficult to see why the P-I is going bankrupt when they are reduced to printing stunts like this.
February 27th, 2007 at 4:31 pm
Hold on…how is this any more irresponsible than perpetuating all the lies about the arena package and not holding our local government accountable for their broad statements that require no accountability…???
As soon as I said that to Danny Weastman during our exchange he never emailed me back.
At this point I am not sure what is worse:
- Local Government
- Local Newspapers
Darn tight race though…
February 27th, 2007 at 4:37 pm
MyK, i agree this thing is such an uphill battle, it seems like every article i read regarding the arenas is against it, and every politician is saying this money can be used elsewhere.. when in reality it can’t… it’s just so frustrating.
February 27th, 2007 at 5:20 pm
If this thing goes to a public vote, will it be state wide or just king county?
February 27th, 2007 at 5:21 pm
I’m a little surprised that there’s not more mention of the Spencer Haywood jersey retiring ceremony. That was a greater highlight than the win in my mind.
The whole thing was done with a nice touch, and Haywood seemed a little awed by it all. Lenny Wilkens repeatedly said Spencer was overwhelmed. Good for Haywood getting in the part in his speech about not letting the Sonics leave.
I had almost forgot that Bill Russell was the Sonics coach until I saw him. It was a nice gesture that he would come to Seattle to watch the proceedings.
And it was great to see one of my alltime favorite Supersonics, Gus Williams. I can picture him vividly playing for Seattle. Man, those were the days when you really had a good team to cheer for.
February 27th, 2007 at 5:27 pm
DK, it’s hard to concentrate on basketball in general when we’re about to lose our team, and all that rich history the sonics have built up in the last 40 years.
February 27th, 2007 at 5:28 pm
DK, it’s hard to concentrate on basketball in general when we’re about to lose our team, and all that rich history the sonics have built up in the last 40 years.
February 27th, 2007 at 5:29 pm
“I had almost forgot that Bill Russell was the Sonics coach until I saw him. It was a nice gesture that he would come to Seattle to watch the proceedings.”
Bill Russell has been a Mercer Island resident for decades.
February 27th, 2007 at 5:52 pm
Brett, the vote will be county-wide. Should it come down to that, efforts should be made to educate the suburban communities (Bellevue, Renton, Kent, Redmond, Plateau, Kirkland, Bothell-Woodinville, Issaquah) of the benefits and the truth. Seattle is a lost cause because the political climate there clouds reality. Campaigns need to to hit the disadvantaged school districts (Renton, Kent, Highline…maybe Seattle but the SD people there don’t actually enroll their kids in public school) as well.
Believe it or not, a state-wide vote may stand a better chance of support. Except for Southern Washington, where the people are Blazers fans, most of the outlying areas do like the Sonics and drive miles in to watch them. Snohomish, Skagit, and Whatcom would all say “YES” to the bill. And sports-crazy Eastern Washington would probably be aboard as well, knowing that the Zags and Cougs would get a Mecca to play big games in.
February 27th, 2007 at 6:00 pm
thanks for the info, casper.. i live in Mukilteo so i will get everyone i know to vote in favor of this if it does come down to a county vote.. i won’t go down without a fight.
February 27th, 2007 at 6:18 pm
I hope you enough King County people Brett!
February 27th, 2007 at 7:28 pm
Ok I take back my earlier Shaun Livingston comment as I thought the injury was minor as reported..
Until I see this
http://www.nba.com/clippers/news/livingston_update_070227.html
So he did tear EVERY single ligament in his knee.
What a bummer, I hope he can come back to the NBA.
February 27th, 2007 at 7:33 pm
Boy, this is the one time where skipping college was the right thing to do. Livingston has money to live off of and wisely invest that would not have been there had he played college ball.
February 27th, 2007 at 8:00 pm
I feel bad for Livingston; tough break. Fortunately he is young enough that he could come back and still have a long productive career, but it’s not going to be easy and that knee’s going to take a while to fully recover. It could take him almost two years before he’s back to where he was before the injury.
February 27th, 2007 at 8:05 pm
That Livingston injury is gnarly. I’m going to try to avoid watching that clip for the rest of my life. Last I heard he tore 4 ligaments. Steve’s right. They are saying 8 months right now…….but I’d think that it’ll be at least another year after that before he that knee feels somewhat normal.
I guess its a good think he skipped college huh. Imagine if that happened to him at Duke.
February 27th, 2007 at 8:15 pm
Well, Shaun Livingston will probably be inactive throughout the remainder of this season and all of next season. On a positive note, however, the Los Angeles Clippers signed University of Washington alumnus Will Conroy to a ten-day contract due to Livingston’s injury.
February 27th, 2007 at 8:39 pm
Well, i think this somewhat helps our playoff chances. The clippers are pretty much done now, unless sam cassell can step up this season and play like he did last year.
February 27th, 2007 at 9:47 pm
Skipping college was usually not as bad for the high schoolers that were not drafted as you would think. People assume that the high schoolers that did not get drafted went on to minimum wage jobs. Many of these players can go oversees and play for 50,000-80,000 a year. Imagine making that much money at 18 years of age. These kids learn a lot of life lessons that they would not have received had they gone to college and just gotten drunk 3 days of the week. Besides, let’s say that their basketball career doesn’t work out for them and they are out of basketball in three years. Even then, they would still have the chance to go to college and could probably pay for the tuition given the money that they have made playing basketball. What’s wrong with going to college when you are 21? Absolutely nothing, you get the same education that you would have received had you gone at 18.
A lot of the horror stories are myths that have been perpetuated with college basketball blowhards and “haters” of the NBA. If a kid couldn’t get drafted out of high school and couldn’t make it to the NBA, then the probability that he would have made the NBA had he gone to college is quite slim. The guy was probably just not very good.
For those that disagree with this opinion, is the college experience different when one enters at 21, rather than 18? I’d say that the kid would be even more mature and focused on his education entering at 21. Many members of our military go back to college at a later date.
February 27th, 2007 at 10:09 pm
Which of the high school kids that did not make it in the NBA are playing in Europe?
February 27th, 2007 at 10:34 pm
Well Steve, I guess I’ve just proven I’m not from the Seattle area. I didn’t know that Bill Russell lives in Seattle.
February 27th, 2007 at 11:00 pm
I did not know that either…I knew he coached the Sonics but never knew he stuck around. Figured that you’d hear about him on the scene much like you hear about Freddy Brown and Slick Watts
February 27th, 2007 at 11:08 pm
Korleon Young made $50,000-100,000 a year playing overseas after flaming out with the NBA. He was making this amount of money at an incredibly young age. For those of you hoop junkies, this kid was ridiculed by the college basketball blowhards with the phrase, “For every Kobe, there is a Leon Smith and a Korleone Young.”
Other examples are DeAngelo Collins, Lenny Cooke, and Ousmanne Cisse. These kids did not deserve the criticism they received for choosing not to attend college.
February 27th, 2007 at 11:26 pm
brian
which representative was hunter last night?was he the one leading the show who made the comment to bennett that people in this area can read?
thanks again to everyone who attended.
will someone give me a reasonable scenario in which the sonics stay.I like bill russell would experience a huge void in my life.
and thats just the way it is.
February 27th, 2007 at 11:34 pm
“which representative was hunter last night?was he the one leading the show who made the comment to bennett that people in this area can read?”
Yeah, that was Hunter. The king of the castle.
“will someone give me a reasonable scenario in which the sonics stay.”
Sure, reluctantly the House and Senate pass their respective bills and they go to the King County Council. The council complains that they’d really like this to go to a public vote but don’t have the authority to put it to one because it was not written into the bill that’s placed in front of them. There’s a lot of rhetoric back and fourth and with the Events Center not opening until 2012-2013, Bennett’s group tells King County that the debt on the Key Arena will be taken care of within the building, or at some point cost overruns will be taken care of on a per diem basis and they relent because King County sure as heck isn’t going to let 300 million in possible tax collections and another tax creating building get away.
What I believe will occur is a series of ‘with reluctance’ type political moves. All parties will basically blame the system in front of them and the project in some form will get done.
Good to see you down there as well;)
February 27th, 2007 at 11:48 pm
scott
thanks and ill sleep well tonight.only take one painkiller for the shoulder.
p.s why cant bennett give the 30 year guarantee van dyk asked for if it would loosen thing uo a bit?
February 27th, 2007 at 11:48 pm
On Mr. Russell living in the area….
..I’ve bumped into him a number of times. We’ve seen him at Red Robin, I saw him recently at the airport. I was with my girlfriend and her sister, we were picking up their cousin from Virginia, and there was Bill waiting in line to pick up his luggage.
None of the three women had the slightest idea who he was. I couldn’t muster up the courage to approach him for a hand shake…I thought to myself “nah, don’t bother the man” but at that point I was just making excuses because I was scared :p
February 27th, 2007 at 11:56 pm
“p.s why cant bennett give the 30 year guarantee van dyk asked for if it would loosen thing uo a bit?”
Because he’s not negotiating a lease with the House of Reps and CVD knows it. If he brings up that same comment at a King County Council meeting with lawyers from each side present it’s somethign that both sides would note to thier lawyers to take care of and it would be done.
The biggest mistake made in the Key Arena situation was the lease doesn’t cover the full retirement of the bonds. They were 20 year bonds but there was only a 15 year lease signed.
Once a lease is negotiated thats the point where they can make the promise of the 30 years that CVD brought up. It was the wrong place to mention it in terms of where it could be accomplished, so for Chris’s side its the right time to bring it up.
February 28th, 2007 at 12:01 am
I like your point Alex. Nobody ever said it was NBA or bust.
My point is that what if Livingston blows out that knee in college? He might not even have the option of Europe. From the reports I’ve read…….it could be career ending.
When Spencer Hawes declares for the draft, ready or not, you can’t fault the kid. Nobody can predict the future. Freak accidents happen. I’d hate to see anybody with an NBA future, have it wrecked before they have a chance to solidify their future. I mean I’d feel bad for the kid if he goes knee to knee in practice with Justin Dentmon and he never plays hoops again. Now that would be a shame.
August 27th, 2007 at 9:11 am
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