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58 Responses to “4/15/07 Box Score: Sonics Lakers”

1. Alex Chan Says:
   April 15th, 2007 at 9:36 pm

   I’m encouraged by the back-to-back 20-10 games for Weezy. The fact that he can produce these games without knowing what the heck he is doing is impressive (or disappointing depending on your perspective). I’ll reiterate my belief that this team’s success in the next two years rides just on whether he develops into a CONSISTENT 17-18 points a game player. The high draft pick will help but unless that guy’s name is Oden or Durant, Weezy’s development or lack thereof will determine this team’s fate in terms of wins and losses in the near future (assuming that Ray continues to play at an all-star level and Rashard remains a Sonic for an amount that is fiscally sound).

2. Myk Says:
   April 15th, 2007 at 9:55 pm

   I’ll reiterate my belief that this team’s success in the next two years rides just on whether he develops into a CONSISTENT 17-18 points a game player

   - I would much rather him be a CONSISTENT 10-11 board player over the 18pts…I’d take 14 and 11 over 18 and 6 or 7 any day

3. Alex Chan Says:
   April 15th, 2007 at 10:00 pm

   I just don’t think Wilcox will become that type of rebounder. Yao Ming is probably one of the hardest working guys in the NBA and he has yet to average ten boards a game. However, he makes up for being an average rebounder for a center by scoring a boatload of points. The same principle applies to Dirk as well. If those guys cannot rebound at 10+ a game, I think we can forget about the prospect of Weezy boarding at that level. However, I am hopeful that the bonus that Chris would receive for averaging ten boards a game may just serve as the impetus for a Rodman-like explosion.

4. Myk Says:
   April 15th, 2007 at 10:20 pm

   Man I miss the 90’s…

   http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mR2c5-XbXfc

5. taro Says:
   April 15th, 2007 at 10:51 pm

   Quick Question…

   How does the lottery for the #1 pick work?

   Considering it looks like we’re a lock for the #5 pick what are our chances?

   Also, if we were to have the #5 who do you think we’d pick?

   Thanks,
   taro

6. GP are you wit'me? Says:
   April 15th, 2007 at 11:10 pm

   “the Sonics lost this game on turnovers”

   Nah bro.. the sonics “Won” this game on turnovers.

   Does anyone have the stat line for Wilcox’ last 20 games? It seems like he has gotten more consistent. Wilcox has gotten more accustomed to his new role as the season goes on.
   I think alot of his unimpressive performances were due to his lack of touches. For the last couple of weeks we have been dumping the ball down low for Weezy and most of the time he got us buckets with his hook shot.

   Do you see anyone besides Oden or Durant that has more potential than Wilcox at the 4 spot?
   If not, we should use that pick to upgrade our backcourt.

7. Perfect Says:
   April 15th, 2007 at 11:38 pm

   Does anyone have the stat line for Wilcox’ last 20 games? It seems like he has gotten more consistent.

   http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3606/gamelog

   His unimpressive performances are probably due to Hill’s inability to execute the most obvious effective gameplans and think in the most logical ways.

   I really don’t like the #5 pick this year, it’s high enough so all the good big men are gone, but all of the decent bigs remain, so much so that we would have to take yet another one. It isn’t low enough to pick up the key backcourt players either. Trade up? Trade down?

8. Perfect Says:
   April 16th, 2007 at 12:05 am

   So Oden has declared and with that, Conley will probably declare. How high do you see Conley going? He impressed me in the championship game, but that’s all I really saw of him. If he plays defense with the effectiveness that was in that game, I would think it would be perhaps the best pick we could make other than Brewer.

9. ichiro998 Says:
   April 16th, 2007 at 12:10 am

   Clay Bennett is goin to have to make some important decisions about the Supes. Management will have to be improved some how to get this team moving in the right direction. Danny Fortson has to go already! Sign Rashard to a multi-year contract. Hope the Supes get a top 5 pick in the upcoming NBA Draft Lottery!! Corey Brewer would be a good pick or a top prospect available!! Hope the Supes make pick the right prospect this year unlike the last couple years!! Go Supes!!

10. Alex Chan Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 12:42 am

    Wilcox’s numbers since Ray went out (starting with the game against the Wizards): 17 ppg/8.6 rbs. His numbers in the past 15 games show me that he is not a very impressive (or consistent) rebounder even when his offensive production is high. However, what is encouraging about the last 15 games is he is scoring at a better rate than he did last year in his time with the Sonics. I’ll take 17/8 anyday from my power forward at six million a year. However, someone on this team needs to be able to make up for Wilcox’s lesser-than-average rebounding for a power forward.

11. g Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 4:17 am

    Did anybody notice that Kobe went 18 for 25? He took only 25 shots and got 50 points. With that and only one turnover a quarter, how were ever in this game?

    Our defense sucks if we are only getting one turnover from the other team per quarter.

    Gelable looks like he almost gets a block on that fallaway jumper:
    http://www.nba.com/video/

    He has so much potential, it doesn’t even seem like his fundamentals are very sound and yet he’s a tight defender.

12. Myk Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 9:38 am

    His unimpressive performances are probably due to Hill’s inability to execute the most obvious effective gameplans and think in the most logical ways.

    - They are due to him actually being able to post up instead of play the high post as Bob Hill seemed to want to have him play while Ray and Rashard were both healthy…

    This, IMO, is Hill’s number one mistake all year. If he had been posting up Wilcox all year and letting Rashard and Ray play the perimeter we’d have been much better. However, I still think we’d be better served replacing Rashard with someone who can drive to the basket. One of Rashard’s biggest problems is that although he can shoot…he is mostly a stand still shooter. I’d rather have who can drive or another guy who can come off screens and hit a jumper.

    So Oden has declared and with that, Conley will probably declare. How high do you see Conley going? He impressed me in the championship game, but that’s all I really saw of him. If he plays defense with the effectiveness that was in that game, I would think it would be perhaps the best pick we could make other than Brewer.

    - Mike Connley Jr. should be our starting PG next year…he is a great athlete and he plays a premium position in the NBA. That is what you spend the 5th pick on.

13. James B. Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 10:41 am

    I’ve never thought of Rashard as a guy who is incapable of driving to the basket. Maybe he’s not assertive enough, but, he can drive to the basket…at least going baseline. I haven’t seen him drive from the top of the key…that I can remember, but, I don’t think he would be incapable of doing that either. I still think he’s very capable of developing into a complimentary player on a championship team, similar to Sean Elliot. I hope we find a way for him to stay (without an outrageous pricetag that mortgages our future).

    Yes, it is realistic to expect 10 boards per game out of Wilcox, especially if he gets 42 minutes like tonight. I’d like to see Wilcox or Collison (or both) have a nice high boards per minute stat like Reggie Evans used to.

    I personally like Brewer and Law better than Conelly. But, all three should be brought in for workouts.

14. Vinny Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 10:43 am

    YES!
    If the last few games have revealed anything, it is that our point guard position is completely obsolete. I mean come on! Mike Wilks is our best point guard! Our draft position should be used in any way possible to fix that position. There is no higher priority. Lewis can walk away. The coach can be fired. The front office can go wherever, but the PG situation MUST BE handled for any success to come our way.
    My only ideas are to trade for Andre Miller (instant fix) or sign and trade Rasahrd for (WHO?) some point out there. Baron Davis? I dont know about him, but, who else is out there?

15. James B. Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 10:48 am

    Vinny–

    There are points in this draft.

16. Vinny Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 11:05 am

    Points?
    Whaddya mean?

17. Vinny Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 11:07 am

    Oh DUH!
    Point guards.
    Well, what about Ray?
    His biological basketball clock is ticking.
    2 veteran Guards could really do a lot with our young big guys.
    I dont know, how long would it take before any PG’s in this draft would be solid players?

18. Griff Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 11:39 am

    Acie Law is a Senior… he wont take 3 years to develop… the nicest thing is that even if he doesn’t turn out to work for us… we’ll know right away instead of the last 3 projects that we’ve drafted, where they aren’t expected to pan out for 3 years, so we have to wait 3 years to be sure… We should know fairly quickly if he will be the solution…

    Trade down, get a know quantity and a 6′3″ scoring PG… I love the idea (even if it doesnt seem like it has much likely hood of happening) of trading Wilcox Watson/Luke and Ray and our pick for Jermaine O’Neal, a 6-12 ish draft pick and some known quantity from a third team to make everything work.

    Lineup
    1 Luke/Law
    2 D-wilk/Gelebale/2nd rounder
    3 Lewis/the guys that play 2
    4 O’Neal/Collison/Petro
    5 Swift/guys that play 4/Sene

    Figure 2nd rounder and sene get practically no time so we have a nice 9 man rotation w/ interchangeable parts so we can create match up problems but always be able to match up ourselves. A great balance of Defense and scoring (Assuming Swift has improved a lot over 2 years)… this is a playoff team…

    then again maybe im stoned out of my mind…

19. Steve Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 11:57 am

    “I dont know, how long would it take before any PG’s in this draft would be solid players? ”

    In most cases you’re looking at 3-4 years for a PG to fully blossom but it can take longer - Billups for example.

    The Chris Pauls tend to be the exception to the rule.

    My thoughts are that PG more than any other position need to be drafted to fit team style of play for max effectiveness, so it would be prudent to have any coaching or upper mgmt changes worked out well before the draft to make sure everyone is on the same page.

20. Vinny Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 12:05 pm

    effin scary

21. James B. Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 12:07 pm

    Yeah, Ray’s clock is ticking. But, I feel like Acie Law would be the best choice. I don’t think it would take him too long to develop. He played until his Senior year, he’s a strong defender, and he’s not undersized. I think he’s the most likely point guard to have a Chris Paul type of a rookie season. That’s a tall order, but, it’s not impossible.

    What we’ll never see again (in my opinion) is a rookie point (Magic) lead his team to a championship. That was the greatest rookie season ever even if Magic was surrounded by amazing talent.

22. Vinny Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 12:11 pm

    We had such a good point for sooooooo long and now….?

    Remember when Gary used to get really pissed off at a call or a non call or something and he used to go OFF and score like 10 points in a row until he calmed down? Along the way making a steal or 3.

    I miss those days.

    Without that type of team leader the Sonics will never go far in the playoffs.

    Fiery competitor. Who has one?

23. James B. Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 12:20 pm

    Griff–

    Am I understanding this correctly: “Wilcox, Watson/Luke, and Ray and our pick for Jermaine O’Neal?” So, if we trade all of those guys and our pick, how do we end up with your roster which includes Acie Law and Jermaine O’Neal? Also, it is much more likely that we’ll be keeping Allen than Lewis on the roster considering Lewis’ contract desires.

    As your last comment notes, I think this may be a bit of a pipe dream.

    But, I do agree with your comments about Acie Law not taking 3 years to develop.

24. Myk Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 12:22 pm

    Trade down, get a know quantity and a 6′3″ scoring PG… I love the idea (even if it doesnt seem like it has much likely hood of happening) of trading Wilcox Watson/Luke and Ray and our pick for Jermaine O’Neal, a 6-12 ish draft pick and some known quantity from a third team to make everything work.

    - Is the difference between O’Neal and Wilcox that much better than the downfall we’d have going from Ray to Wilkins as our two?

25. Myk Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 12:24 pm

    As your last comment notes, I think this may be a bit of a pipe dream.

    - So giving up 3/5 of our starting 5, a top 5 pick for O’Neal, a rookie PG and a decent veteran (unnamed) and that is a pipe dream? I’m pretty sure that Indy would love to get three starting level players and a top 5 pick in a great draft for O’Neal…

26. Myk Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 12:52 pm

    Would anyone do a S/T of Lewis to Utah for either Okur or AK47??

27. Alex Chan Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 1:18 pm

    I would have done the sign and trade for last year’s Kirilenko, but not this year’s unmotivated, injury-prone Kirilenko.

28. Vinny Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 1:29 pm

    If we could trade Ray, My pipedream wish would be for Rip Hamilton.

29. Balloholic Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 1:48 pm

    Chauncey Billups?

30. James B. Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 2:21 pm

    I still don’t see a sign and trade of Lewis being that realistic if he demands the maximum. We won’t sign him, and few teams will trade for a max contract.

31. Myk Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 2:28 pm

    - Well a S/T for the max would imply that another team was wanting to give him a max contract. If he demands the max and we don’t give it to him and other teams don’t give it to him then obviously he would have to sign for less.

    - I guess one problem AK47 is having to play SF…so I am not sure how well he’d fit on our team. But it would be intriguing to have a guy who averages 2blks and 2steals a game….of course he is injured AGAIN, so maybe it wouldn’t be that great of an idea.

32. hoopster Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 2:29 pm

    “If we could trade Ray, My pipedream wish would be for Rip Hamilton. ”

    Good grief Vinny. Why not go for broke and trade Ray for, say, Greg Buckner? Or Matt Carroll?

33. Vinny Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 2:33 pm

    Obviously it wouldn’t be straight across…..

34. Myk Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 2:52 pm

    Wait trading Ray for Hamilton is a joke…but Ray/Wilcox/Watson/5th pick for O’Neal/Unnamed Decent Veteran and the 14thish pcik…isn’t worse?

35. mark in bothell Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 2:56 pm

    assuming the sonics stay and i care about the draft,how does tie breaker work w/sonics ,knicks,wolves and trailblazers?
    which one of you smarties can tell me that?

36. DK Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 3:07 pm

    Thank goodness more people are seeing that pointguard is where the biggest change needs to be. But even though there are pointguards in this draft I really like( I honestly have equal respect for Conley and Law), history tells us that no rookie is going to make a huge difference in his rookie season. Deron Williams took a whole season. He wasn’t impressive one bit last year. Ray Felton only showed up the last part of his rookie year, and really hasn’t elevated his game hugely this season although I would give up Seattle’s pick for him. Steve mentioned Chauncu Billups, and I like to use him as an example of a player that bounced around until he found both the right situation and a newfound game. Chris Paul was definitely an exception to my rule and all the credit to him. But he was a bluechip stock and everyone knew that he was going to fly(except for Atlanta). All these players were projected higher than either Law or Conley.

    That’s one reason I would like to somehow get Devin Harris on the Sonics. He’s a proven player on a proven team and after this year he will be battle hardened by playoff experience. I don’t see him as one of those untouchable players, but if he were in control of a team and didn’t defer to Dirk or Terry my guess is that he would be a terrific pointguard and higer on the radar than he is now. He’s one of the fastest guards in the game and he plays solid defense. But because he’s a favorite of mine my judgement is clouded I’ll admit.

    But if I had to choose between Acie Law or Mike Conley then I think I would tilt just a little towards Law. Conley could have more upside but Law I think has been more of a leader in critical situations. But either would fit a need. Is the age and college experience difference a legitimate factor?

37. Scott Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 3:19 pm

    “assuming the sonics stay and i care about the draft,how does tie breaker work w/sonics ,knicks,wolves and trailblazers?”

    If we lose to Dallas we end up 5th. If we beat Dallas and all three of those teams lose there would be a four way tie and the only tie breaker would be for any remaining combinations after they are added and divided by four. Then the order of the actual draft would depend on where you land in that tiebreaker order.

    Literal coin flip.

38. Myk Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 3:22 pm

    If we lose to Dallas we end up 5th. If we beat Dallas and all three of those teams lose there would be a four way tie and the only tie breaker would be for any remaining combinations after they are added and divided by four. Then the order of the actual draft would depend on where you land in that tiebreaker order.

    Literal coin flip.

    - Only if they don’t get one of the 3 picks. For the Lottery purpose all the balls will be added up for those positions and divided evenly for all the teams…so if pick 6 gets 100 and pick 7 gets 50 then if you tied you’d both get 75 balls.

39. hoopster Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 3:23 pm

    “Wait trading Ray for Hamilton is a joke…but Ray/Wilcox/Watson/5th pick for O’Neal/Unnamed Decent Veteran and the 14thish pcik…isn’t worse? ”

    I’ll be nice and just say that both leave more than a little something to be desired.

    I know it’s human nature to think that the grass is always greener on the other side, but some of the stuff I read on here just leaves me dumbfounded.

40. Myk Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 3:29 pm

    But if I had to choose between Acie Law or Mike Connley then I think I would tilt just a little towards Law. Conley could have more upside but Law I think has been more of a leader in critical situations. But either would fit a need. Is the age and college experience difference a legitimate factor?

    - The only issue I have with Connely is that his shot is not ultra consistent as of yet. However, Connely is a better distributer, has a higher FG% (slashes to the hole better), got more steals and is much, much better all around athlete than Law.

    As for leadership, Connley was THE leader for that team. While Oden might have been the best player he was not the leader of the team…so I don’t think there would be any problem with him being a leader in the NBA. This was a guy who played like a SR. in the NCAA Tournament.

    The biggest issue with Connley is that he might not declare…

41. Myk Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 3:38 pm

    I want to say that it is very depressing that every time I go to ESPN to check something the death count in that VT shooting keeps going up…22-27-29-33

42. mk Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 3:45 pm

    Yeah, I had to read the ap headline a couple times because is sounded wierd that they’d be saying the gunmans age..

    Then it his me..

43. mk Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 3:45 pm

    Yeah, I had to read the ap headline a couple times because is sounded wierd that they’d be saying the gunmans age..

    Then it hit me..

44. chncasper Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 3:55 pm

    1 hour left, i suppose we’re not hearing from Brian because he’s fighting hard somewhere behind the scenes in Olympia.

45. James B. Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 4:42 pm

    Yeah, that is very depressing, Myk…

    On a different note, has anyone seen Stephon Marbury’s “Stars on Stars” interview program? I watched the episode where Marbury interviewed Kareem today. It was a great interview, and it really increased my respect for Stephon. I like the way he seems to have a respect for those who came before him and the history of the game. It was really a breath of fresh air that I wasn’t expecting.

    I think a lot of people in my generation have a short term memory in sports because they never really had a chance to see Wilt or Kareem play, so those guys aren’t really a part of the conversation as the best player of all time. People just assume the best player was Jordan because we saw him play; he was a part of our generation.

46. NK Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 5:06 pm

    I think Acie Law would be the perfect fit for the Sonics. He’s a proven clutch player (look at how many times he saved A&M just this season). He has a very high basketball IQ and great court vision… and, last but not least he has a certain level of intensity that we are severely lacking. Anyone else feel like none of our guys are really passionate about the game and what they do in it? Might be the weather… I don’t know, but I think we’ve turned into this passive team that don’t necessarily care about the outcome of the game. I think Law would be a great addition and a great mid- to long-term investment when he develops even further.

47. Speedcat Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 5:20 pm

    Wish I had seen these last few games… would be interesting to see how Mike Wilks plays when he’s got minutes. Looks like he got 5 turnovers this game; anyone care to comment on his ballhandling skills or other play? thanks

48. Alex Chan Says:
    April 16th, 2007 at 10:12 pm

    Who cares about the draft? The arena debacle today has nullified much of my interest about the draft. The time that we have sought to avoid is here. Doesn’t make much sense debating about Rashard Lewis this or Bob Hill that.

49. Steve Says:
    April 17th, 2007 at 12:12 am

    This is BS. Three years in a row and some of our pols are hoping that Bennett will be flexible on his deadline. Money talks people. Bennett doesn’t have to be flexible on anything, but we have to show him the money before next March 1 or our goose is cooked. These progressive idiots aren’t very progressive in saving the Sonics and solving problems around here unless you are a member of a favored class (like being gay or something). While I agree it isn’t over until it is over, this sucks. All along I have been saying that we shouldn’t worry about what is happening in OKC, New Orleans, or any place else. We needed to take care of business here, and our stinkin’ leaders can’t even do that.

50. DK Says:
    April 17th, 2007 at 7:45 am

    I see in the Seattle Times this morning that Rick Sund says that re-signing Rashard Lewis is the Sonics #1 priority this off season.

    It then goes on to say that the Sonics might look to trade either Ridnour or Watson in a package with Swift, Petro, or Sene.

    The picture looks a little clearer, at least with the on floor product. Look to keep Lewis, find a starting pointguard by either trading for one or drafting one. The only question is what they will do with their draft pick, whether they keep it, trade it up or down.

51. Perfect Says:
    April 17th, 2007 at 3:56 pm

    If we are looking to keep Lewis, I don’t see how we can look to trade Ridnour. That’s throwing away a lotttt of valuable chemistry.

52. James B. Says:
    April 17th, 2007 at 3:58 pm

    In light of DK’s post, it’s nice to know that we at least have a small picture of what the future holds. Say what you want about Lewis, but, he’s more deserving of $ than many of the guys on our roster in my opinion.

    Here’s a one sided trade in our favor that will probably never happen:

    Johan Petro and Earl Watson for Shane Battier and Luther Head.

    Eventhough Ridnour has had a lousy year, I’d rather keep his 10.4% salary ratio than Watson’s 23.3%. We can get a better player with 23.3%… (NBATradeChecker)

53. James B. Says:
    April 17th, 2007 at 4:13 pm

    Here’s another potential trade that would help us with Charolotte:

    Luke Ridnour, M. Sene, and Peter Fehse for Raymond Felton and Sean May.

    For Northwest homegrown players lovers it has the added perk of putting Ridnour and Adam Morrison onto the same team.

54. James B. Says:
    April 17th, 2007 at 4:29 pm

    This gets addictive. One more:

    Ridnour and Petro for Salim Stoudamire and Josh Childress.

55. James B. Says:
    April 17th, 2007 at 4:44 pm

    Any takers on Joey Crawford in a Crawford vs. Tim Duncan fight? LOL. Duncan wins that one hands down. Man, that’s crazy.

56. Dick Tate Says:
    April 17th, 2007 at 5:35 pm

    If we are looking to keep Lewis, I don’t see how we can look to trade Ridnour. That’s throwing away a lotttt of valuable chemistry.

    Judging by the team’s record over the past couple of seasons, I’d say you’re putting a tad too much value on that chemistry.

    Luke Ridnour, M. Sene, and Peter Fehse for Raymond Felton and Sean May.

    Sorry, James… i’m afraid that AK is the only one that’s allowed to use Fehse’s name in trade scenarios.

57. Perfect Says:
    April 17th, 2007 at 6:26 pm

    Guess so, I’m almost sold on Conley at this point

58. Robert Jackson Says:
    April 22nd, 2008 at 8:28 pm

    Hi guys i’m new to this chat box thing. I sure hope the Sonics stay here in Seattle

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