New Years Joy
Posted on Sunday, December 30th, 2007 at 10:15 am by Brian Robinson
Good Morning. Too long since I blogged.
Glad to see the change in the lineup yesterday. I wholeheartedly agree with the move and was glad to see we got a win. I hope that we don’t get hit with that many more injuries this season. Wilcox’ fall looked like the kind of one that can be bad. Lots of sideways movement to the Kneecap and lets face it, the knee is not really meant to move that way.
If Chris happens to be out I probably favor inserting Delonte West at the SG, moving Durant to the SF and Green at PF. We wind up giving up some size but having a team that can really push it up the floor. I don’t think that would be the way it would go however. More likely Nick steps into the PF and Johan or a returning Robert Swift take the backup minutes.
Robert is basically healthy and planning on returning. He had expected to return after the last road trip but got some conflicting instructions from his doctor. I am not sure whether it came from him, his agent, the team, or maybe a combination of all of them but somehow it became said that nobody can afford for him to come back anything less than 100%. While he felt good they decided to phase him in, giving him 1 week of running, 1 week of drills, 1 week of contact scrimmage, and 1 week of full contact practice before he considered retuning to a game. That is where the month came up. Maybe they’ll decide to move his schedule ahead a bit if Wilcox is out.
Watching this team has made me realize a couple of things. First of all we are a crappy team today and we are SO MUCH BETTER ON DEFENSE IT IS BARELY COMPARABLE. Knowing that makes me realize just how far behind we were defensively in recent years. I have that same feeling about our bigs. Now I love Nick Collison and Robert is my boy but lets be honest. Kurt Thomas is a scrap. He’s an aging veteran who was tossed aside by Phoenix. They gave us two first round draft picks to avoid paying his contract and it is not like they are noticeably worse without him. So if he is this much better than our other bigs what does it say about them? Perhaps we need to re-evaluate how good all of our other bids are in comparison.
No disrespect to Kurt in that last paragraph. He has been a great addition to the team this year. A really, really solid player.
On the arena front I have to continue the frustrating process of asking people to be patient and advising that there is action behind the scenes. They mayors office promised a completed proposal a couple of weeks ago and they have one. Unfortunately Clay Bennett continues to re-iterate that he will not consider a Key Arena option or even have the discussion and that is the only plan that is being worked on. There is corporate sponsorship available and viable local ownership groups. The big question is whether the league will let a guy move a team simply because he doesn’t want to negotiate. I have been told very clearly and specifically that there will be no rubber stamp process in moving a team from this established market if there is ANY viable arena plan on the table that has revenue streams which are equal or greater than those available in OKC. If that is true, then the city basically has the ability to block a move by putting a competitive package together.
There are major forces that acknowledge that the full enforcement of the lease make it really difficult for Clay. 3 years of lame duck status is a tremendous loss of revenue and also a huge black eye to the league. They have to constantly explain it to their corporate partners, broadcast partners, and everyone else with an interest. We have been really supportive of the team, and continue to call for people to participate, but at some point if there is a viable local arena and a viable local owners and the league just pretends they don’t exist we will have to consider whether next season the fans should boycott. It would be a huge move to call for and not make me any friends but little by little it gets harder to give the team money. Could we actually get people to picket in front of the arena on opening night next year? Could we convince longterm season ticket holders to trade their 2 $100 seats for a single $10.00 seat, keep their priority number, but pass on the next year or 2?
I’m not there yet. I’m not even burning bridges with Clay if he’d come back to the table. I don’t think he will but the situation changes dramatically once Seattle steps up with an offer. Cross fingers and work hard to ensure that it gets completely wrapped up in the coming weeks.
Look at Portland and their 12 game run. I ask myself “If that happened in Seattle today would it save the team?” I think the answer is probably yes. It is as simple as that, a stroke of luck/success/karma and suddenly the building rocks for fan support and a community outcry are there. It’s frustrating.
We’re getting much closer to the trade deadline and I can’t get any sense of whether the team is working on a deal or not. We played .500 this month and looked pretty competitive. Will they try to make a trade simply to cut salary and prepare for the 2 year battle? Will they try to consolidate players to get a more streamlined rotation? What kind of direction are they looking to move? I have no idea.
I want to again thank Chris Meirose for his maintenance of this site. They guy is just consistent and awesome. He is the Jeff Green of this forum always bringing it in ways that don’t show up on the highlight real.
December 30th, 2007 at 9:46 pm
The Grizz don’t play in St Louis, somebody was willing to give it another shot for the final two years of the lease in Vancover, I just hope that this time around we have somebody better than Shin. You could throw a headband into the Key Arena front row and hit a better owner at random.
A better option for the NBA here, and an Saints vs Hornets choice for public support in NO, may get the sports fans in Seattle, NO, and OKC, what they really want.
I bet Shin beats Bennett back to OKC.
December 30th, 2007 at 10:05 pm
And another thing, we might want a center drafted in the top 5. Not to knock Collison, Swift, Sene, but not one of them was selected in the top 5 picks for a reason, they are who they are, or you hope they become more, but that reality is that they are middle 1st rounders. While I’m here, Watson and Wilkins are playing really well for guys that were not drafted in the 1st round, too bad we need starter quality players in starter roles, that isn’t them, that is possibly be one of the many first round picks we have coming.
I think Green is a #5 pick, I don’t think he will be a star, but he is clearly a better all around player than Wilkins and he is a rookie, Wilkins has had every chance and plenty of PT, and practice it elevate his game, but no, he is being replaced by a #5 pick. A lot of really good players, role players and bench players are drafted in the middle of the first round, that’s where we have been selecting centers from, we should not be unhappy with who they are.
December 31st, 2007 at 12:17 am
Thanks for the update on the arena/ownership situation. It continues to be a fascinating & complicated situation. It is simply tough to have an owner who just wants to take the team away and makes no effort to keep the team here. All the energy to keep the Sonics here & get a new arena etc. is coming from outside the team ownership.
I hope these efforts are really happening & some solid news will be coming soon.
If an arena deal comes together with political support along with a local ownership group that says they will go with it if they can buy the team - it will indeed IMO put huge pressure on Stern & the NBA to push Clay to eaither take the deal of sell the team.
December 31st, 2007 at 12:22 am
Brian, I’m curious as if you would be willing to share your thoughts as to whether the New Orleans Hornets could play any role in terms of Seattle having some NBA franchise when the Key’s lease expires? The Hornets could be a legitimate title contender, if they aren’t already one, if they were able to draw more fans to their games.
December 31st, 2007 at 12:44 am
Time for a winning streak?
December 31st, 2007 at 2:31 am
13 in a row now. If you guys had a win streak like that, the whole league and every media outlet would be talking about you and the Sonics-Blazers rivalry would only get better. Personally, I’d like to see something like that that would help keep the Sonics in Seattle.
December 31st, 2007 at 2:35 am
Mt Baker - And another thing, we might want a center drafted in the top 5. Not to knock Collison, Swift, Sene, but not one of them was selected in the top 5 picks for a reason, they are who they are, or you hope they become more, but that reality is that they are middle 1st rounders.
Word on the street was that if Swifty went to college for a year or two he would have been a lock for a top 5 pick, maybe even top 3. I remember Jay Billas saying that when we drafted him.
December 31st, 2007 at 2:47 am
Hey Mr Baker.
Look at this Players:
Mehmet Okur - 2nd round, 38th overall
Carlos Boozer - 2nd round, 35th overall
Rashard Lewis - 2nd round, 32nd overall
Leonardo Barbosa - 1nd round, 28th overall
Andrei Kirilenko - 1nd round, 24th overall
…
1984 Draft:
Sam Bowie (C) - 1nd round, 2th overall
Michael Jordan (SG) - 1nd round, 3th overall
The Draft is like a game:
you don know, whats in the box when you chouse it…
December 31st, 2007 at 4:41 am
I’m also curious towards possible roster changes before the trade-deadline.
As Brian said, the team faces a possible lame-duck status and although a winningstreak as portland’s might save the team, im not too worried about the basketball-side of the story. With clay facing massive losses over the next few years he will probably want to avoid the team slipping too far behind.
If he’d move the team after basically letting the roster bleed out, he’d also be facing some serious issues towards turning a profit. Top free agents often don’t want to go to crappy teams, so it will be even harder to rebuild to a respectable roster. The players who do go to lesser markets are usually not ‘winning’ players and they’re just looking to get overpaid or be the man on a bad team, which doesn’t get anyone anywhere.
So the way i see it, if clay sabotages the team basketball-wise, he’d better be prepared to pay up for it later. Which he isn’t…
December 31st, 2007 at 9:10 am
So the way i see it, if clay sabotages the team basketball-wise, he’d better be prepared to pay up for it later. Which he isn’t…
He’s already sabotaged the team! The arena situation would be a lot easier to get done if we had a hot rookie and were on our way to a 50 win year with a good run in the playoffs. We are on our way to maybe the WORST regular season ever, how can that be helpful?
December 31st, 2007 at 9:11 am
Presti should go after Andre Miller with the likes of Ridnour or Watson and perhaps Wilcox, to even up the salaries. Sweeten the deal with a first-round pick and the point-guard problem becomes a blessing over the next few years.
December 31st, 2007 at 9:18 am
This team finally looks comfortable with a few young pieces entrenching themselves within PJ’s system. Green is a beast and Durant’s potential seems limitless. I imagine a guy like Gordon or Rose will be selected next year and then a guy like Brand, J. Oneal or Marion will be signed as a free-agent the following year to complete the championship contending roster.
December 31st, 2007 at 9:18 am
Sonicsballer, I do remember what Swift coulda, woulda, had he played college ball, I was at the Sonics draft party, and still have the t-shirt. My point is that he didn’t go to college and he was not selected top 5 and drafting him as a high school player meant hoping that he would become the player with the talent of a top 5 pick. We did not draft in the top 5, we hoped that we did, and so we wait. Maybe he is or becomes that guy, maybe he doesn’t (I think he can be, though he isn’t now), but he did not arrive in top 5 pick condition. He really is the Sonics best hope for center, but that is based on hope and not on what is.
December 31st, 2007 at 9:41 am
Isn’t that 13 straight for Portland? Anyway, thanks for the arena update Brian R..
I disagree about Swift, and the reality is that even a fair amount of Cs’ drafted in the top 5 don’t live up to the expectations(so what about a late lottery pick?). Guys like Eddy Curry, Kwame Brown also drafted straight outta high school haven’t lived up to expectations. So with that reality(combined with what I’ve seen from him so far), my hope for Swift(compared to the day we drafted him) is now extremely low, and I was one who actually had alot of hope for him initially…
December 31st, 2007 at 9:50 am
HOOOOP says…
“He’s already sabotaged the team! The arena situation would be a lot easier to get done if we had a hot rookie and were on our way to a 50 win year with a good run in the playoffs.”
I agree - how amazing that the “Arena situation” involves an ownership group that is doing NOTHING to try & get a deal done - It’s been that way since Clay bought the team IMO. His efforts with Renton & Olympia were not serious or sincere - just a “Show” to be able to claim he tried in good faith to get something done to give him a better chance for a future lease buyout & approval from the NBA owners to move. Since he Clay left Olympia he has done NOTHING to build bridges, relationships and rally people to try & get this done.
In any city it is tough even with a team’s ownership trying to support & lead the effort to get a new arena built - these are huge, expensive & complicated projects - but to do it in this situation is even tougher. Not impossible - but even more difficult.
December 31st, 2007 at 9:52 am
I imagine a guy like Gordon or Rose will be selected next year and then a guy like Brand, J. Oneal or Marion will be signed as a free-agent the following year to complete the championship contending roster.
In the 40 year history of the Sonics we have never signed a major free agent, we have signed a few decent role players but it drives me crazy to hear people say we can go out and sign a major free agent it’s never been done before!
December 31st, 2007 at 9:55 am
The Sonics will not have anything like the Blazers win streak this year. They are just not very good. The Sonics are headed for about 20 wins. Line-up & rotation changes will not make much difference.
I’d focus on developing the young guys and using minutes to determine who the Sonics want to keep or not keep for the long haul. This might mean giving more minutes for a stretch of games to a young guy like Petro or Gelly or when healthy Swift to see what they can do. Giving Green the starters role is a step in the right direction IMO.
December 31st, 2007 at 10:08 am
JJ Says:
Since he Clay left Olympia he has done NOTHING to build bridges, relationships and rally people to try & get this done
I thought PJ was going to get an assistant coach with ties to the team, Detlef, Sikma come to mind, I’m sure there were others he could’ve hired. Not one major person in the front office with a history here. These aren’t major issues but little things like that help rally people to the cause, Im surprised he hasn’t taken down the banners in the Key and put up San Antonio’s.
Clay is hoping for apathy and it’s impressive that our attendance is as good as it is.
December 31st, 2007 at 10:14 am
While like the majority of us fans I think it’s clear that pointguard and center are the two holes that need filling the most, I’m kind of torn on what is the best way to remedy the situation.
Make trades at the deadline to improve now and lose out on a top 3 pick, make trades that free up roster spots for next season while making the team stay the same for this season so they have a shot at a higher pick, or something in between?
A Mike Bibby for Delonte West and Wally Szczerbiak trade achieves the first method but what would it do for down the road?
About the draft. Here’s a few non mainstream names that could be Sonics in June. Richard Hendrix-6′9″ 260lb PF, compared to Paul Milsap. Courtney Lee-6′5″ SG, compared to Anthony Parker and considered possibly the best defender in college with a extra high basketball IQ. Nathan Jawai-6′10″ 280lb C from Australia, a beast but raw but a good way to hide a second round pick for a while. Jason Thompson-6′10″ PF. Chris Douglas-Roberts-6′6″ SG/SF from Memphis, considered a tough slasher who can get to the foul line, compared to Jerry Stackhouse. Jerryd Bayless-6′3″ PG from Arizona, a favorite of mine.
Some of these players will be available with the Suns pick, plus the 2 second round Sonics picks. I’m just throwing out some random names to consider this morning just for fun.
December 31st, 2007 at 10:16 am
jj, that is what is going on, they want to have both Swift and Ridniur 100% before they play them in games not so they center win more games, but so they can evaluate them. My guess is that after the league owners vote, and after OKC votes to upgrade the Ford Center for the Hornets, that we will see they guys they think they will keep playing with they guys they want a good read on before summer. Right now you have to look at the guys you might keep that also might have trade value before the trade deadline. Pedro and Gelly might be keepers, but their trade value is near zero. If the Sonics don’t know or do know and want to trade any or all of the three W’s then you showcase them now, after February, they will move on to look at the rest and to more development.
December 31st, 2007 at 10:21 am
wow, I butchered that, don’t make pancakes and text at the same time is the lesson for me today.
December 31st, 2007 at 10:48 am
Mr. Baker’s draft pick level / expectations comment is an interesting one that I agree with generally at least for first contract. Second contract the quality level should be what they’ve done and hopefully can continue to do. Sund paid either as much as he had to or too much in some of these cases to try to avoid the cubbard appearing too bare but it eventually did and he got relieved because of it.
Looking back at 2003 draft, real quickly I’d estimate Collison the #12 pick is getting paid now about the 15th most. His performance probably rates him around 11th best in class. He delivered expected level of performance relative to class (some higher didnt and some lower delivered more but he roughly kept his rank) and got paid appropriately. His pick worked out but didnt really give Sonics much edge for upward competitive movement at least yet.
Ridnour picked 14th, performance might bave been in 15 best til a year ago might be 15-20 or even lower now. Pay is comparable to 15-20th best guys. His pick was working out, may again but is somewhat shaky right now and at the least is not a bonanza.
Wilcox picked 8th in 2002 and getting paid about 8th right now. Another average delivery of performance on expectation relative to rest of picks and paid accordingly now.
Wilkins undrafted, got a break and got playing time early, got a decent contract. Is near a league average wing (all wings not just starters) with a paycheck that is well below league median pay. Based on origins and expectations he has worked out ok. Again not a real diamond in the rough, just a decent placeholder.
#12 pick Swift still has chance to become one of the 15 best players in that draft class. He is still potential and has really played very little for 4 years. #24 D West is probably 15th best in class right now. Ans will wanted to be paid like it, somewhere near MLE. Whether he still has upside or has reached his level of performance and degree of PG doneness is the real question. I tend to view him as a growth stock but still don’t know enough to be sure.
Hopefully Durant & Green deliver performance equal or greater than their draft rank. If they do they will be paid accordingly.
Still need a true GM performance /contract success story to help move up the competitive chain further. The Kemp great value to salary ratio was a key part of 90s Sonics success and then their undoing.
December 31st, 2007 at 10:59 am
Mr Baker… hope you enjoy your pancakes!
I hear you - I assume the Sonics are trying to balance minutes around the goals of evaluating players and the trading deadline can impact this to some degree. I think Presti & PJ should use this year as a type of “audition” - almost a 1-year training camp in terms of making decisions on this key question:
Who do we want here long term around KD & JG as part of our core in the coming years - especially beginning in 2009/2010 when KD * JG begin to hit their stride and move towards their prime?
They need to make key decisions on if they will invest in more $$$ & contract commitments to Wilcox, Luke, Earl, Swift, Wilkins, West when their current contracts run out. Figuring out if Petro, Sene & Gelly are keepers is important too.
Winning is always desired but player evaluation & development is a key goal for the Sonics this season in a unique way because of the new coach/GM, the presence of a young superstar to build around and the reality of being in the front end of a major overhaul/rebuilding process with the loss of Ray Allen & R. Lewis who were the teams 2 main stars prior to this year.
I expect about 1/2+ of the current Sonics to be gone in a year.
December 31st, 2007 at 10:59 am
I have told in detail why Swift should not have a contract in this league.. He has no drive, very little ambition, and yes boys no ballbag at all.. I have seen alot of players like Swift highly reguarded and what they call a stand still where everyone else seems to get better. Danny Ainge and I have had many disagreements over Swift as he liked him coming out of high school. His opinion has changed as even he knows Swift is another one who is going to slip through the cracks. When you talk about having a guy in the post who can help this team, right now it’s Thomas, he lacks athleticism at his size to be effective.. So anyone who really thinks Swift can help this team now and 2 years down the road is probably juicing early on New Years, and really does not know the post position.. Everything I see him do, is basicly lame.. I talked about the Dream and playing him, let me tell you this fellas if Swift even attempted to cover the Dream, it would be like going to a comedy show.. I am not going to talk of Swift anymore, as he really does make me sick.. I wish my dad had him, he would either have quit, or been starting right now on an NBA team..I seem to think my old man would have got to him, and instead of kissing his ass he would have tried to make him a player, but it comes from within you have to have that drive where no one can stop you, he has never had that, I had it at a young age, and still do to this day. And yes I thank my old man every day for what he taught me about life, but more than that how to be a decent person..
December 31st, 2007 at 11:00 am
Ray1984 Says:
So the way i see it, if clay sabotages the team basketball-wise, he’d better be prepared to pay up for it later. Which he isn’t…
I disagree. If Bennett sabotages the team, he could potentially roll into Ok City in 2010 with five top-five picks in tow. That would be a rather attractive situation for many a free agent, imo.
epx Says:
Isn’t that 13 straight for Portland? Anyway, thanks for the arena update Brian R.
The post time says 10:15am but it didn’t show up on the main page until last night. There was another post by Brian last week that never made it to the main page. He may be having computer/posting problems.
December 31st, 2007 at 11:05 am
Crow, I don’t know about Collison being the eleventh best player in his draft class. I would rank Collison’s career thus far below the career of the following guys:
James, Anthony, Bosh, Wade, Howard, West, Hinrich, Ford, Kaman, Barbosa, Walton, Williams, Diaw, and Blake. Given my bias towards three-point shooting, I may even put Kapono ahead of him. I’m not sure if Pavlovic or Perkins would go ahead of Collison but I’m pretty sure most GMs would take Perkins over Collison because of the age disparity. Outlaw has also had a breakout season. I’d place Nick ahead of Petreus and Hayes, the two players drafted ahead of him.
December 31st, 2007 at 11:10 am
NBA attendance figures are easy to reference at this site: http://www.sportsnetwork.com
New Orleans has not sold out a game. Seattle has two. Average attendance for NO is 11,902. Seattle is 13,886. Total attendance to seats available NO is at 66%. Seattle is at 81%. NO is a playoff bound team. Seattle is….well you know. If the NBA thinks we don’t have viable options and no fan base to support our own franchise they are clearly turning a blind eye to New Orleans. Before anyone says “Katrina” look at the Saints attendance numbers. New Orleans never supported basketball before Katrina, they didn’t support the Jazz when they were there and they won’t support Hornets. Wake up NBA!!! It’s not working in NO, it’s not working in Memphis and the Sonics owner wants to move to OKC.
December 31st, 2007 at 11:15 am
“I have been told very clearly and specifically that there will be no rubber stamp process in moving a team from this established market if there is ANY viable arena plan on the table that has revenue streams which are equal or greater than those available in OKC. If that is true, then the city basically has the ability to block a move by putting a competitive package together.”
These are my feelings exactly! I have been thinking about this ever since OKC started talking about using their trashy 89 million dollar arena to house the relocated. Everyone I talk to still thinks I am crazy, but I don’t think this team is going to move. In my opinion that really axed Clay at the knees once again….first it was Mclendon with his comments, and now this. I don’t understand why he doesn’t tell those around him and those in his camp to shut up.
On team thoughts…while I have my opinions on what should go down. But I am really excited to see what Presti is going to pull off.
December 31st, 2007 at 11:19 am
beantown Says:
I am not going to talk of Swift anymore, as he really does make me sick.. I wish my dad had him, he would either have quit, or been starting right now on an NBA team
He’d be starting his 2nd straight season by now if he hadn’t blown out his knee. Does your dad teach rehab?
December 31st, 2007 at 11:19 am
“I disagree. If Bennett sabotages the team, he could potentially roll into Ok City in 2010 with five top-five picks in tow. That would be a rather attractive situation for many a free agent, imo. ”
Not for a while. It didn’t work out that way for the early 00s Bulls with lottery picks all over the roster needing playing time for the future. They had to trade for virtually every veteran of consequence on their roster.
The sabotaging the team conspiracy theory has never made any sense to me. The team is more valuable both financially and also as a trading chip for Bennett if it’s a good team.
If you posit that the team under Sund Walker was that badly run then why is it such a stretch to believe it might actually take 2-3 years to rebuild or undo the damage they did instead of everything happening overnight?
December 31st, 2007 at 11:23 am
I will tell you a little something, I do know Sammy Presti very well as I had him in camp when he was in high school at Concord Carlisle. When we speak I often will tell him what I think, I will not say we agree all the time, but I do know he values my opinion, and knows I know the game.. He has told me that he team will not move several times, if the lease has to played out in that time there will be interest in selling the team. Bennett is willing to take a financial hit, but at this point if he moves the team it will be a total loss, and that will continue with a new team.. I can not say how Sam feels about Bennett as that is something I will not share as Sam does work for him. My point with this, I think Bennett is going to force himself to sell the team, he is not well liked here, and now the NBA has gotten a whif of his shit, and it is all starting to stink…
December 31st, 2007 at 11:30 am
Does sonicscentral.com have T-shirts? I have worn a Sonics shirt or hat every day since Howie sold the team. I need more variety and less laundry. Also would like to support team and you guys simultaneously. Brian, if you don’t have shirts then can I use the logo and see what I can get done at CafePress? I assume you can get my e-mail address from the site.
December 31st, 2007 at 11:33 am
Beantown, George Shinn has been putting his methane emissions out under the nose of the NBA for years and he is still got the keys to that franchise.
December 31st, 2007 at 11:34 am
Dick Tate Says:
“Does your dad teach rehab?”
Priceless!
December 31st, 2007 at 11:38 am
No Dickie my boy he taught heart something that Swift didn’t show up that day to get.. I had 6 surgeries my man and yes I blew My knee out, and rehab was my second home. So very lame comment, watch him during the games on the side lines fooling and having a great time. Did you see Durant the other night when he got hurt, very much into letting his team he was there. Swift sucks end of story.. You are seriously telling me if he did not blow his knee out with his ballbag he would be in his second year in the post for some team, get off the sauce it is not that time yet..
December 31st, 2007 at 11:43 am
One question Dickie my boy, how can Swift help this team??? Very simple question, how can he.. I will put my boots on because here it comes… What skill does he have??? Again I want to laugh my balls off..
December 31st, 2007 at 11:45 am
“I have worn a Sonics shirt or hat every day since Howie sold the team. I need more variety and less laundry. Also would like to support team and you guys simultaneously. Brian, if you don’t have shirts then can I use the logo and see what I can get done at CafePress? I assume you can get my e-mail address from the site. ”
Dork, email brian@sonicscentral.com before you do this.
December 31st, 2007 at 11:48 am
I’ve been to six games this year and what stands out most to me is what a bad coach PJ is. His use of timeouts and substitutions is terrible. If I was GM I would get a new coach then start changing players.
December 31st, 2007 at 11:49 am
Dreamer, you know you are a dreamer!
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=2780~1027~1731~2506~193~933&teams=14~14~14~14~25~25&te=&cash=
Someone slip Riles a mickey before getting him to sign off on this one.
December 31st, 2007 at 11:58 am
Thanks Steve.
December 31st, 2007 at 12:07 pm
“Dreamer, you know you are a dreamer!
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=2780~1027~1731~2506~193~933&teams=14~14~14~14~25~25&te=&cash=
Someone slip Riles a mickey before getting him to sign off on this one.”
NO KIDDING!!! Hahahaha…IF Presti were able to pull something like this off ya gotta give em’ a key to the city.
December 31st, 2007 at 12:07 pm
Fire PJ, please! I see Wilcox or Johan chocking him soon
December 31st, 2007 at 12:20 pm
hey beantown, I still want to hear your scouting report on Collison and Wilcox.
Are they keepers, or should Sam put them on the market?
December 31st, 2007 at 12:31 pm
Beantown says
My point with this, I think Bennett is going to force himself to sell the team, he is not well liked here, and now the NBA has gotten a whif of his shit, and it is all starting to stink…
If Bennett is forced or decides to sell to a local owner in 08 I think that alone is good for 10-15 more wins next season! The cloud that hangs over the team from his bullshit will be lifted.
December 31st, 2007 at 12:38 pm
Alex 11th best in draft class as of now for Collison might be a little high, it certainly would be absolute top, most generous ranking. Maybe it is 15, could be a little lower. I didn’t debate it long, just making a broadbrush comment that he worked out about as epeceted on performance, pay, value.
Swift had a half season that was nice on offense and rebounds but not defense for a young big. He has to prove it from scratch again. I don’t feel I know what he will deliver when he gets back because it is still unclear how healthy he will be. Will he be a decent role player or better or worse? I don’t feel in position to predict with conviction. I am definitely not a huge backer but I personally won’t dismiss his chances altogether either of having some value, keepiong a job in the league.
Collison might be around 30th best center in the league. Best case maybe Swift gets to 20th best in a few years (Bogut, Horford level)? Expected case (right now due to injury) might be closer to 40th? (Milicic, Skinner Armstrong) I think he can be 50-60th best center (Harrison, Gray, Ely) under worst scenario.
When he was first drafted I wondered if his offensive instincts and size (long, lean) could work like a McHale. That isnt possible at 270 or the 280 he was. Swift at 255-260 and a C/PF combo using his shot (high post or baseline) might have been the better approach than either team or Robert himself thinking he was a future power player. Raef LaFrentz comes to mind for some parralels but I’ll stop there for now.
December 31st, 2007 at 12:40 pm
beantown Says:
One question Dickie my boy, how can Swift help this team??? Very simple question, how can he.. I will put my boots on because here it comes… What skill does he have??? Again I want to laugh my balls off..
You can keep your slippers on as I’m not a huge Swift believer.
He can block a shot, get an offensive board, somewhat decent jumper, not afraid of contact. I don’t think he has any great standout skills but being a 7 footer and having adequate skills in most areas is usually good enough to start in this league.
If he didn’t have the knee setback, would he be great? Not likely. Probably nowhere near the top half of the starting centers in the league. By no means do I see him as the “answer” for the Sonics in the middle. Just saying he’d be the starter until (if/when) the position could be upgraded.
December 31st, 2007 at 12:42 pm
I wish people would stop with the Swift fantasy. Are you the same guy’s that thought Rich King, Stepania and Mcilvaine were going to be good. By the way great players in the NBA stay healthy, Payton misses 5 games in 12 years and 2 were for fighting, Jordan misses a half season with a broken foot early in his career and very few games after that, Stockten, Malone miss about 20 games the whole time together in Utah. Name 1 great player that started off injury prone and developed into anything? Maybe Danny Manning that’s all I can think of.
December 31st, 2007 at 12:54 pm
I’ve seen Swift do a nice job on the pick and role forcing guards way out on the perimeter. I’ve seen him bang with Shaq a bit. If he has lost his quickness that might be a problem. The other thing he lacks is confidence - I have so far attributed that to youth - but he should be coming out of that. He has a decent touch on the outside and he can pass decent too. I would give him all the time he needs to get better - he is still only 21 or 22 after all.
December 31st, 2007 at 1:04 pm
I like Collison, he was a smart player at Kansas and knows the game, but at 6′9 where does he really fit in. More of a role player who stays positive and will come in and give you good minutes, I do like his opening to the ball on defense, he does lack mobility at times to be a good defender.. Wilcox, he is big and strong but so lazy at times. He shows he doesn’t have a bad jumper not good but not bad, yet he does not work for the ball. If you have a guy held off which at times he does down on the block, he really looks like he doesn’t want it. At that point when you have guys thinking shoot you demand the ball let them know hey I have this clown on me that I am dying to school, give me the f-en thing.. Would I keep them, not for an athletic defender, who has some scoring capabilities.. Dickie my boy you are wrong he does not have adequate skills to play in this league, he has no skills at this level my friend, that I know first hand my man. Oh yeah dickie my man my old man was 6′8 300 pounds so I do bet you Swift would have listened to him, and the only rehab he would have gotten would be how to play with intensity, something Swift does not have a bit of..
December 31st, 2007 at 1:21 pm
“Now I love Nick Collison and Robert is my boy but lets be honest. Kurt Thomas is a scrap. He’s an aging veteran who was tossed aside by Phoenix. They gave us two first round draft picks to avoid paying his contract and it is not like they are noticeably worse without him. So if he is this much better than our other bigs what does it say about them?”
As much as I like KT….its a great point. I think he looks like Shaq compared to the other Cs we have on the roster. Collison is ok….but he is what he is. Swift/Petro/Sene are all pretty bad in terms of NBA calibar centers.
“I’m curious as if you would be willing to share your thoughts as to whether the New Orleans Hornets could play any role in terms of Seattle having some NBA franchise when the Key’s lease expires? The Hornets could be a legitimate title contender, if they aren’t already one, if they were able to draw more fans to their games.”
1. Hornets aren’t for sale
2. They haven’t filed for relocation
3. Even if the above two weren’t true…..they would still never come to Seattle without a new arena here.
The situation remains the same. No arena…..no team.
December 31st, 2007 at 1:22 pm
“By the way great players in the NBA stay healthy, Payton misses 5 games in 12 years and 2 were for fighting, Jordan misses a half season with a broken foot early in his career and very few games after that, Stockten, Malone miss about 20 games the whole time together in Utah. ”
Those guys are the exceptions, though. Not a reasonable baseline for comparisons. Is Shaq a great player? He’s missed his fair share of games the past few seasons. Ray Allen? McGrady?
“Name 1 great player that started off injury prone and developed into anything? Maybe Danny Manning that’s all I can think of. ”
Chris Mullin
Chris Webber
Chauncey Billups
Tyson Chandler
Steve Nash
all missed a significant percentage of games their first 3-4 years in the league. That’s pretty much off the top of my head, I can probably think of more guys given time.
December 31st, 2007 at 1:24 pm
Marcus Camby another guy who lost a lot of time to injuries.
December 31st, 2007 at 1:28 pm
“The situation remains the same. No arena…..no team.”
I think you meant “new” arena. Brian’s post seems to indicate that a remodeled Key Arena, rather than a new arena, is what will be presented to Clay. If your analysis is correct, then this team will be gone as I didn’t get the sense from reading Brian’s post that any new arena proposals are on the horizon.
December 31st, 2007 at 1:29 pm
RE: Swift
“I would give him all the time he needs to get better - he is still only 21 or 22 after all.”
The problem is we don’t have time. He is a FA at the end of this season. We have 3 1/2 months to decide if he is the future at the center position. If not……#12 pick down the tubes.
December 31st, 2007 at 1:37 pm
In terms of permits and using the existing footprints it needs to be labeled “remodel” but essentially it will be a “new” building. Just like the last remodel. The city needs to sell it correctly.
But yes…..potentially….Bennett could sit down and say “remodel……I said new building. meeting ajourned.” Scary thought huh.
December 31st, 2007 at 1:45 pm
new arena/remodel = same thing.
December 31st, 2007 at 1:53 pm
Ah the semantics issue again. hello semantics my old friend, I’ve come to talk with you again …
“But yes…..potentially….Bennett could sit down and say “remodel……I said new building. meeting ajourned.” Scary thought huh. ”
At which point it’ll be pointed out that a “remodel” is exactly what he’s getting in OKC. Not a “new” building.
“Brian’s post seems to indicate that a remodeled Key Arena, rather than a new arena, is what will be presented to Clay. ”
They can keep one beam from the old place, demolish the rest and call it a remodel.
“The situation remains the same. No arena…..no team. ”
Yes. No arena, remodeled or new … no team.
December 31st, 2007 at 1:55 pm
Kurt Thomas is a very good defender. He is not scrap or crap or whatever. He is very good. On the other hand, he is offensively challenged. If I was Presti I would be looking to deal Thomas to the Lakers for Jav Crittenton plus Kwame Brown’s expiring contract. Not sure they would go for it, but Thomas can guard Duncan pretty well.
December 31st, 2007 at 2:11 pm
Before you guys think about who should go and who should stay talent wise, look at what type of attitude does this player have. Is he a team guy or looking to fill some stats, very important in todays game where playing to win seems to be secondary. Am I old school a bit, but I do know that attitude goes a long way, even now in this league. I have spoke of Tom Brady, I golfed in a Jimmy Fund Classic with him and some Red Sox players.. I have never seen such a positive attitude in sports, I talked to him a bit about team chemistry, he blew me away with his positive leadership. I know some people who know him well and can’t say enough positive things about him. I did not come on here and want to talk about the Tom Brady, I played against some of the greatest athletes ever to play the game and have met some people in sports you would dream of meeting, very few were or are like Tom B.
December 31st, 2007 at 2:27 pm
“At which point it’ll be pointed out that a “remodel” is exactly what he’s getting in OKC. Not a “new” building.”
Good point.
December 31st, 2007 at 2:29 pm
I’ll agree with beantown that for a team to achieve great things good attitudes are part of what’s needed and at a higher level leadership is aso critically needed as with Brady- a guy that other players respect, like with follow and bring their best selves out with. Among the team returnees Sonics do not any leaders. Some have good attitudes (at the role player level) but not leadership. Durant & Green have good attitudes and may well become leaders. The team either gets it from them or new guys coming in the next few years. Some teams can draw off coach as the main leader but I don’t think that is the case with PJ.
December 31st, 2007 at 2:29 pm
Menace Says:
“RE: Swift
“I would give him all the time he needs to get better - he is still only 21 or 22 after all.”
The problem is we don’t have time. He is a FA at the end of this season. We have 3 1/2 months to decide if he is the future at the center position. If not……#12 pick down the tubes. ”
Good point to remember. This has been my second biggest complaint about drafting 3 young projects. First complaint was not getting a real veteran in here in the mean time to actually play and teach them. But the NBA length of contract eliminates most of the value of finding a diamond in the rough. These guys come out of HS not ready to play, spend 1 year learning how to find the charter plane, another year getting schooled in limited minutes, then maybe start to contribute, and it most of the first inexpensive contract time is up, wasted on developing a guy for another team if they leave, or at best we have to pay big bucks to keep them. We could just have paid the big bucks and had a player for all those years. If the contracts worked differently in the NBA it might make sense to spend several years developing guys but not the way it is.
December 31st, 2007 at 2:30 pm
should be in above post … “will” follow
December 31st, 2007 at 2:30 pm
“Those guys are the exceptions, though. Not a reasonable baseline for comparisons. Is Shaq a great player? He’s missed his fair share of games the past few seasons. Ray Allen? McGrady?”
Shaq missed most of his time in the last few years after the rings and maybe 30 games in his 3-4 year.
Allen, McGrady that’s what is keeping them from really being special they cant stay healthy. What if Ray doesn’t miss 27 games last season and Lewis doesn’t miss 22? maybe we make the playoffs. McGrady is hurt every year. How many guys come back from serious knee operations like Swift missing a whole season early in their careers?
Maybe your right Steve but I think for the most part great players stay healthy.
December 31st, 2007 at 2:37 pm
crow, agree with you about the value of the players and the second contract. I see that you agree with me, in general, about the first contract and draft position. We just haven’t had a center that is picked top 5, that had top 5 talent on draft day, here as a rookie one day one.
December 31st, 2007 at 2:43 pm
I agree with TukwilaSonic. Unless you feel you can get a pretty surefire and immediate impact player the value of a draft pick early in career often isn’t special and may not stick with you.
Phoenix has largely abandoned the draft. It can do that because of climate/winning and get free agents, often cheap good vets.
Sonics can’t do that. Either have to pick more immediate hits or starting using the MLE on the right guys.
Spurs take young bigs but at bottom of 1st round or in 2nd round they are good values whereas mid first round like with Sonics young bigs is 2-4 times the cost (more the later in the contract) and not necessarily.
Unless you really really like a mid-first rounder to fill a slot well soon I think trade down is often the right instinct though it may be hard to do.
Some study I saw said (I think) bigs taken in top 5 way better than 5-15 and 5-15 not that much more reliable than later. If it didnt say exactly that, that is at least how I feel.
December 31st, 2007 at 2:47 pm
Mr. Baker if Sonics get a top 7 pick my general inclination would be take a big this summer if a true 7 big is available. If they pick later I’d more likely go PG with pick and gamble the low extra first rounder on a big.
December 31st, 2007 at 2:52 pm
I will say one thing about Shaq that is somewhat amazing.. Night in and night out my man gets the shit beat out of him by a number of players on the opposing team. Yes he is so big that the only way to play him is to foul him or keep him away from the basket. He does not react the way most would when he gets hammered. I know first hand how it is to go against him, his legs are so strong he can push you off the block by using his thigh. Sometimes you would post on the block, all of a sudden your on the elbow and don’t know how you got there.. He is my man I know him very well, let’s just say we have some history together….
December 31st, 2007 at 2:57 pm
And I should have said full MLE guys. Splits for $2-3 million role players can sometimes make sense to fill holes but if you are a long ways from playoffs you need to bring in players with full MLE performance or better and hopefully as adds to core not just retain existing role players that way. Exactly what level of performance is good enough for full MLE … Ridnour, Collison, Wilcox might be enough on 2. But could you do better with $20 million a year? I think you should and need to in order to advance. If they had passed on one deal maybe they could have gotten in position to get a $10 mil player, if not yet, soon. I’d have preferred to have that level of talent and a low salary guy instead of one of those 3 for $20 mil. But that was Sund’s work.
Who Presti wants to pay (and Bennett actually pays), how much or doesn’t remains to be seen.
December 31st, 2007 at 3:04 pm
“Mr. Baker if Sonics get a top 7 pick my general inclination would be take a big this summer if a true 7 big is available. If they pick later I’d more likely go PG with pick and gamble the low extra first rounder on a big. ”
Lots of time until the draft shakes out, but assuming that Rose goes #1 overall if Sonics don’t end up with top pick I probably look to go big too if the right guy is there. Darren Collison among others probably available in lower first round, but if Seattle can’t get Rose I would prefer having a more experienced guy running the show rather than waiting on a rook PG to put it together for 3 more years.
December 31st, 2007 at 3:10 pm
Bennett wasn’t in position (not yet officially the owner) where he either could or did say enough to stop handing out all of the Ridnour, Collison, Wilcox deals. I think he didnt want to rock the boat. But he will have to get better deals from Presti or show better feel when to say no himself.
December 31st, 2007 at 3:26 pm
Anybody has seen enough of Donta Greene to have an opinion if he is anything like R Lewis, Josh Howard or Durant or Marvin Williams or whoever in style or could fit between Durant & Green at SF or split PF with Green I’d be interested to hear more on him.
December 31st, 2007 at 3:28 pm
I think Swift can set a decent screen, and can put a body on someone, but that’s about it. Unfortunately, he can’t really roll off screens(too slow, ackward, & uncoordinated to catch the ball and make a play). He can’t pop either for a midrange shot. Defensively, it seems that he can position himself well, but slow reaction times limits his shot blocking, and yes, anyway big with athleticism, and quickness(i.e. dream) can(or could) take him to school pretty easily. I think he brings very little to the table unfortunately. I guess he could prove me wrong, but I’m not really shaking in my boots…
December 31st, 2007 at 3:43 pm
hey beantown, there’s been some discussion here (mostly between Dick Tate and myself) about Presti’s concept of building a new “culture” for the Sonics.
Knowing Sam as you do, what are your impressions of his idea of culture, and also maybe you could throw out some names of players and/or teams who you think play the game the “right” way.
Thanks as always for the interesting thoughts…
December 31st, 2007 at 3:43 pm
Beantown, I was grading Swift (pre-injury) on the curve against all 6-11+ centers in the league going into last season. I’d be tough to list 30 that were better than him. If you’re including all of the power forwards that many teams had playing at the five spot (due to their own lack at the position), then I see your point. I don’t disagree with you on the intensity issue, a problem afflicting many of the Sonics big men. Frankly, I don’t have much passion for arguing what Swift might’ve been. In the here & now, I think the injury combined with the added bulk may have wrecked whatever he had going for himself.
December 31st, 2007 at 3:47 pm
“It’d” be tough
Good question, JC. While you’re at it Beantown, was was your take on the last several Sonics coaches?
December 31st, 2007 at 5:26 pm
i am just wondering… how much total $ will the proposed keyarena “remodel” cost? i seen somewhere that it was 250 million and somewhere else that it is 300. which is right?
December 31st, 2007 at 6:30 pm
Steve, I agree with your point about not compromising for a pointguard in the draft. I’ve gone as far in thinking that someone like Kirk Hinrich for the say #5 pick would be a great trade( of course Seattle trades others to make a salary match).
Beantown, you’re dead one to question mental profiles before trading for someone. I think most teams have some sort of psycological testing with draft picks before they make up their minds, so I imagine a GM takes attitude into consideration with trades as well.
I also remember reading somewhere that one of the Sonics from their championship team saying that their team was so close they went out to dinner and movies together in their off time. I know from experience that the Vancouver Grizzlies usually bolted quickly from the dressing room and took off with their own possees and didn’t form any bonds( I hung around one of them for a bit and learned about how players feel when not playing).
December 31st, 2007 at 7:08 pm
I like Robert, everybody knows that. He’s a good guy and cares a lot about basketball and also about the fans. His whole family has settled here and they are all good people for the community.
That said I think he really has a limited understanding of the total concept of hard work. He is a tremendous worker in the weight room and during drills, practice, etc. He thinks that is enough. He doesn’t get the fact that part of what you do to be a consummate professional is you adjust your mindset to understand that you have to want to be great at ALL ASPECTS of your trade. Practicing hard is great but the real pros work with their coaches better, practice diet 24/7, are focused on the little aspects in life that make them more competitive people. They also take personal responsibility for their problems.
I like would say this to Robs face and not have any qualms about it.
I think some of you guys are writing him off too quickly however. He came into the league young and he has struggled to learn how to carry himself as a person, not just as a player. The framework of hard work and ability are there, he just needs to mature. Some young people just suddenly “get it” and others don’t. I think that because he is a decent person surrounded by a solid family there is still a likelyhood that he will one day wake up and just figure a few things out.
Its hard to pay him millions of dollars per year waiting for that day however.
December 31st, 2007 at 7:16 pm
In response to an earlier post.
I think New Orleans plays a huge role in our situation. For starters the overall lack of attendance combined in NO, Memphis, and Charlotte paints a picture of league wide crisis and incompetence rather than a localized situation. The fact that they are talking about moving yet another team to that region raises a collective concern that helps put roadblocks in the way.
New Orleans specifically affects the game because, even though they could stay until 2012 there is also a very real chance that they move in the next 3-6 years. That means that there is another franchise in play, potentially one to move here, Oklahoma, sell to Clay, whatever. Having it in play affects the negotiating leverage of everyone involved. My personal feeling is that Clays real purpose in filing for relocation in October was that he felt he absolutely had to have staked first claim to the Oklahoma City market before Shinn does. If he had waited until the end of the season there was the potential that someone else would have filed for relocation. You watch. If he does get pressured to sell to local ownership he will be “rewarded” for that service by being awarded the rights to the Oklahoma merketplace. That is what he paid to get in the game for.
Someone told me a very insightful comment. One big problem we face is that Clay overpaid for the team, making it hard for a local owners to come into the picture. From this guys perspective he said “The value of the Sonics is not based on what CLay paid for the team, it is based on what it costs him to get a new team in the Oklahoma market. Clay paid $360 million as his ante up to get into the club. If an expansion franchise costs him $200 million then letting the Sonics go for $200 shouldn’t be an issue. He wanted in, he set the price he was willing to pay, and he got what he wanted for the money.”
December 31st, 2007 at 7:25 pm
Brian Robinson said:
“The value of the Sonics is not based on what Clay paid for the team, it is based on what it costs him to get a new team in the Oklahoma market. Clay paid $360 million as his ante up to get into the club. If an expansion franchise costs him $200 million then letting the Sonics go for $200 shouldn’t be an issue. He wanted in, he set the price he was willing to pay, and he got what he wanted for the money.”
That may be true in theory - but the money that Clay & The OKC Rustlers borrowed to finance to Sonics would still need to be paid back. Yeah, they might be forced or even willing to lose a little, but a lot? Unless they think the OKC locals would bail them out?
December 31st, 2007 at 7:31 pm
Brian my man you are dead wrong about Swift. I did see him this summer working out when I visited Sam, he had his shirt off. Brian my man he is out of shape big time. I am twice his age and am more cut than he is.. He is never going to be effective in this league. You do have to have dicipline, and make alot of sacrifices to play in the NBA, I know that first hand. I also know as well as I know my kids he will Never and I mean Ever be effective in this league. He may be the nicest kid in the world but his intensity since he was in high school is not there. He sucks Brian big time did you hear me my man he sucks , oh yeah for the last time I am telling you BOBBY SWIFT SUCKS BIG TIME…..
December 31st, 2007 at 7:46 pm
New Years resolution I am done talkin about Swift, I can tell you he will not be here long to talk about.. Cortsense Sam has discussed culture when relating to this team, he has touched more on the mental aspects of getting this team on the same page.. Sam can talk, he has a way with words that can make you understand what he wants to do.. The most surprising thing to me When I heard Sammy got the job is that he is a really nice kid, they are going to eat him alive.. Sam really is a great kid, no bs about him, has great work ethic, and yes boys he will get it done here. He is not cut throat, more will explain the situation, and his best asset is he listens, and then he learns. When he got the job he was interested in having me interview for a position in scouting or player dev. as I have said I have quite a few kids and would much rather be dad at this point in my life. I did tell him to put it on hold, because I am itchy to get back into it..
December 31st, 2007 at 7:48 pm
Maybe thats his problem to nice of a guy.
You gotta be a little mean to be good.
December 31st, 2007 at 8:02 pm
beantown, Presti may be a nice guy, but I doubt anybody on this team will eat him alive.
To my way of thinking, it took some pretty big balls to trade Ray and let Rashard walk away. The easiest path would’ve been to bring back last year’s team and take a season to “evaluate” the personnel. To push the buttons and completely blow it up told me Sam has a vision and the balls to back it up. Now he just needs to show us the vision will actually work.
December 31st, 2007 at 8:25 pm
Bobcats got into league for a $300 million expansion fee in 2004.
$350 million might be real close to what an expnasion team might have to pay to enter right now. In a few years it might be more depending of health of league economics but existing franchises will rise too.
Bottomline I don’t expect Bennett would get an expansion team for much if any below what he paid for Sonics. But he would avoid a relocation fee and perhaps the next 2 years of losses depending if he sold soon. I am not expecting quick resolution, certainly not before lawsuit runs its course.
Whether Sonics could be sold to local owners for $300 million or $350 or $400 million I don’t know. I can’t put a lot of hope on that prospect until the lead potential investor goes public. And the situation moves to where a sale is more possible.
December 31st, 2007 at 8:29 pm
Exactly it took alot of balls to trde Lewis and Allen. I have told Sammy it is going to take awhile as we all know to build this team. It’s in the mean time that is the hard part, I have told Sam to remain positive as he is going to tae some hits. As far as being to nice a guy, he does have balls my man and he is tough.
December 31st, 2007 at 8:30 pm
If Stern cut Bennett a break and gave him an expansion franchise for $300 million and / or waived the relocation fee and Bennett sold Sonics for $300-350 million he should probably feel getting in the game paid off.
December 31st, 2007 at 8:33 pm
Forward strength probably looks a little different than 7+ footer strength.
But weightroom strength is not the same as court strength as that adds a need for savvy and toughness.
December 31st, 2007 at 8:41 pm
I have no fear of players eating Presti alive at all.
Maybe the owners will surprise on budget or moving or end up blaming him if progress doesnt go as fast as they feel it should or intervene and make calls that he anticipated he would make fully on his own (they did hint retained power when they said something to the effect that Presti would make calls in coordination with ownership. Has that already come into play? We probably will never know.)
Other GMs? I don’t think that highly of a lot of them, so probably not. Though you could argue that he facilitated the deals for Boston and Phoenix and maybe could have demanded more. I assume he partly did it to break into the club and get a good reputation as a guy who you could do deals with and isn’t standoffish and unreasonable. That can backfire as with Scott Layton I think.
December 31st, 2007 at 8:43 pm
At least Layton for a stretch in NY.
January 1st, 2008 at 6:28 pm
What Brian said about NO is similar to what I’ve written on my blog and here over the past few months. I call selling the Sonics and getting a new or cheaper team into OKC trading down. 360 mil team (or 450k house for that matter) is worth less in OKC. That’s the market. So, paying Seattle prices for a team or house in OKC is a horrible investment, the ROI for the same dollar here vs there is painfull to think about, bleeding money for 3 years on top of that hurts. Also, Bennett isn’t just rebuilding the roster, he’s restructuring the player contract liainility down to fit the smaller market.
I still think Shin can “Al Davis” Bennett, his team could play games there today if something happened to the arena in NO. That is one vote Bennett can not count on, same with Memphis, OKC citizens want a team, if they put which team the Sonics would come in a distant second.
Yet, the trading down, changing cities, says a lot about the state of the NBA. The league can not have the Sonocs move one year, the Hornets the next, the Griz after that, it becomes a forgotten sport in a hockey, I mean hurry. The FACT that a team does not have close to the same value, or a high enough league shared revenue base makes chasing the short money for the small market owners a requirement. It is not like baseball, but it sure as heck isn’t anwhere near football. Let’s not forget, the Nets are moving on top of the small market issues.
Unless Bennett can move the team to a bigger market he is taking a long term hit. He could write off losses here and resell the team like Howard did if there was even a slightly better lease, which was what Howard asked for. But spending 360 mil and moving to OKC makes reselling for a profit unlikely in the near term, and harder later. If he thinks getting a sweet heart deal here is tough for him, try being an out of towner buying the team from Bennett 15 years from now and trying to get a new arena there. NF-way, that team would be on the move again.
anyway, he trades down, sells out, or he’s taking it in the shorts for 10 years
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July 2nd, 2008 at 10:09 am
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Mercedes
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July 25th, 2008 at 12:40 pm
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