Props to Ray Allen
Posted on Wednesday, November 19th, 2008 at 9:21 am by Brian Robinson
So 2 offseasons ago I took all kinds of crap for criticism of Ray Allen after the trade.
No matter how many times I tried to say that I legitimately like Ray and actually was a huge fan of his while I was here people wanted to accuse me of being a “basher”. There were people who were just mad at me overall for making the criticism.
With any professional athlete(and I know a lot of them) there is a really fine line between confidence/swagger and attitude/cockiness. The really great players know they are great. Even those who are at the low end of the NBA have been great their entire lives. They were the best player on their high school team, the best player on their college team, then they hit the NBA and in order to compete most of them think that they are the best player in the league. You could take Flip Murray today and he would tell you that he is the most skilled basketball player in the world and that he just hasn’t found the right opportunity where people will utilize him. Sad but true.
Ray Allen has swagger to a tremendous level. His confidence is not just on the basketball court. Ray glows in the dark. He knows damn well that he is not only the best athlete but that he’s smarter than almost everybody in the room. He’s more charismatic, better looking, taller, better dressed, knows more about cars and fashion, has more friends, has a hotter wife, the whole nine yards. It really is amazing to be around him.
He is also extremely particular and a total micromanager. Knowing that he excels in so many ways he wants just about everything his way. Stories from players and management have him wanting to make decisions on everything from how to market the team, practice routines, who is allowed in the locker room, how people dressed, what music was played, etc., etc. He demanded in the way that only very confident people can that his teammates line up behind him and not question the way he wanted to do things. That is just fine when you are a superstar and the leader of the team. I questioned, and I think it was a legitimate question whether that attitude would fly when he was no longer the centerpiece of an established franchise but rather the veteran secondary piece on a terrible team building around a young superstar. I felt that there was a real chance that KD could have a strong personality and the franchise would want him to be the centerpiece. Ray would want to control all the details and that friction could develope between him, the team, KD, and the younger/older players. I think there was a worry of factions developing between “Ray’s guys”(yes members of the team would actually talk all the time about other players saying “He’s just Ray’s guy. Kisses Ray’s ass all the time…blah…blah..blah), Kevins guys, and players who just want to play and don’t choose sides.
Now, 2 years removed from his trade I think I can say that Ray has answered my questions by proving so well his ability to adjust his persona and fit in as the third fiddle in Boston. It is obvious of course that Kevin Garnett is an extremely powerful personality and that winning helps. Without KG there to guide things and a virtually frictionless championship season maybe Ray would have chaffed but I see no signs of it. I see a guy who has shown the ability to put aside his ego when it is not necessary and adjust his role to the circumstances around him. I really respect that.
Knowing that Ray has this ability to put aside his ego I see young Kevin Durant who has (in my opinion) proven that he does not yet have a strong enough personality to lead the team. He is simply too young and does not have the natural assertiveness necessary to be the kind of professional leader that Ray is. Kevin needed and still needs to learn lessons from a guy like Ray more than he needed to establish himself in the current leadership void. I really feel like it would have been very beneficial for Ray to continue being the leader of the franchise AND that he would have been able to set this role aside at any time if Durant developed the persona necessary to become the franchise centerpiece.
So kudos to Ray Allen who has answered any doubts I had about his leadership. He has shown me a pretty remarkable balance between confidence and attitude that I think is only possible because he is so damn smart. I never meant for this to be a heavy criticism. Nobody is perfect but Ray Allen is apparently closer than I had previously thought.
I’d encourage any of you to check out
Trying to sort out public and private commentary regarding the arena right now. Is Ross Hunter part of the problem or part of the solution? I get very different vibes from him than those that are portrayed in the paper.
There is a concern that the mayors office simply does not know how to sales pitch this thing to anybody. The convention center needs to come on board and they are slow to move their feet. Without them there is a serious problem.
Lots of meetings this week. Multiple members of the legislative committee, they Governors people, mayors people, and a bunch of people with various organizations. I should be in position to provide a pretty good update by the middle of next week. That will probably be the point that, if there isn’t some type of real action and movement, I start to get critical publicly. These guys can’t keep saying “wait until next month” forever.
November 19th, 2008 at 9:30 am
Three articles that were linked in previous threads but are worthy of being put here for new conversation:
http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=10646
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/blog/ball_dont_lie/post/Magic-Sixers-Grizzlies-attendance-woes-mirror;_ylt=AgTzM96mA52snO8rlaTnuse8vLYF?urn=nba,122913
http://www.nypost.com/seven/11142008/sports/moresports/its_nbas_your_show_of_no_shows_138594.htm
November 19th, 2008 at 10:51 am
Mr. Baker really nailed a couple of points in the last thread -
“They have worked really hard to oversell a dull product to corperations [sic] to be seen at.
Many in America watch ultimate fighting while the NBA goes to a no hands rule. The NFL puts on a better tv show at a stadium than the NBA does on their local telecasts. The NBA uses pretty good camera work on nationally televised games, the NFL does as much on every game. How the NBA is shot and viewed needs to get out of the 1990’s.
The no hands rule is one if many softening of the game rules that have dulled the action, the on court drama of direct competition between two players, each on a team of five.
Allowing a player to defend the way they could a dozen years ago would allow guys that have complete games to rise to the top in popularity.
Watching guys jog 70 feet and shoot jumpers against a zone defense is boring.”
The NBA has become dull and its exclusive focus on offensive numbers has not worked to its benefit (Not that they’re the only league to focus too much on offense). But other sports have found ways of making their TV product exciting or not just making it about one guy.
My view has always been that the league needs to market the names on the front of the jersey a lot more and the ones on the back a lot less. 15-20 years ago it was unusual that a team would trade a guy like Ray Allen, or Allen Iverson, or Jason Kidd … but all of those guys have played on at least 3 teams in their careers. Since the fanbases aren’t developing those deep connections to players, people have less invested in the league itself.
There are two factors that have brought a whole new audience to sports in the late 20th-early 21st century: Fantasy sports and gambling. The NFL and MLB have been able to take advantage of these and use them to promote interest in their entire product, thus building their respective fanbases and growing interest in their sport. The NBA hasn’t been able to do this. Basketball does not lend itself to fantasy sports the way the other two do and it’s not much of a gambling sport either because of the officiating.
Case in point, last time Brian, Scott & I were in Vegas I was playing a triple parley on the NBA, if I won all 3 games against the spread it was a decent payout, something like 2.5 or 3 to 1, but probably not as much as I could make betting NFL because there are a LOT more ways to bet on an NFL game and more people betting. Back to my triple parley, all I remember was that it was Utah playing somebody and Utah was the favorite by 6 or 7. Late in the 4th they’re up by 13 or 14 and naturally Sloan pulls his starters. In the last 2 minutes of the game the other team pulls off a 7 or 8 pt turnaround and Utah wins the game but doesn’t cover by one. All it would have taken is one foul call, one free throw either way to change the outcome …
If the NBA is to survive their self-imposed marginalization they truly need to become community partners and start marketing their teams more over their players. There are a lot of people who do not like NBA players and will not support anything to do with them but will support a team with the name Seattle attached. In a soft sports market like this one that kind of marketing is critical. I thought Ray Allen was a good player but I never thought of him as being an integral part of this community like Gary and Shawn were and for some reason he just never really felt like the face of the franchise to me.
November 19th, 2008 at 11:19 am
I have been a diehard Ray Allen fan since I first saw him play at UConn, and will continue to list him as my favorite player in the NBA until he retires.
If more players composed themselves like Ray on and off the court, the NBA would certainly stand in a more positive light to fans and non-fans alike.
November 19th, 2008 at 12:31 pm
Great to see you lost the weight Larry…Go buy some shorts now!!!
November 19th, 2008 at 12:38 pm
If the NBA is to survive their self-imposed marginalization they truly need to become community partners and start marketing their teams more over their players. There are a lot of people who do not like NBA players and will not support anything to do with them but will support a team with the name Seattle attached. In a soft sports market like this one that kind of marketing is critical. I thought Ray Allen was a good player but I never thought of him as being an integral part of this community like Gary and Shawn were and for some reason he just never really felt like the face of the franchise to me.
- Very true…another thing they need to figure out is why they were so successful in the early 90s. Right now the NBA has some of the best young talent it has ever had. LeBron James is quickly becoming as good or comparable to Michael Jordan. Chris Paul might be the best PG to ever play the game…and yet does anyone really care?
Maybe in other markets they are a bigger deal. But, when MJ was in his prime he was everywhere and he was a superstar. I just dont get that from LeBron yet (yes I know he is on TV alot)…
The Bulls were a team you either turned on to cheer (other than your home town team) or to hate. The Lakers might fit that role…but not nearly on the same level. Where are the intense rivalries?
The NBA just isn’t what it used to be
November 19th, 2008 at 12:56 pm
Rmcd, that’s a winner. +1, if we were in Deadspin world.
Apparently the guy has lost some serious pounds, but still walks around creepily and naked.
November 19th, 2008 at 1:02 pm
Ghost of Sheff-He needs the dark shades when he’s outdoors.
November 19th, 2008 at 1:04 pm
Maybe he can’t afford any shorts. He could only afford the shaver for his chest.
November 19th, 2008 at 1:10 pm
Well, at least he’s confident enough now to sport himself on nude beaches instead of lurking in corridors.
Where are the intense rivalries?
The NBA just isn’t what it used to be
Blame Mike. Who were the Bulls rivals? Who cares, people just wanted to see Jordan play. He became bigger than the game and the NBA has been trying to find the next Jordan ever since by promoting player over team. They even changed the rules so individual one-on-one players could shine.
November 19th, 2008 at 1:36 pm
Now would be a good time for the State to push job creation - the budget forecast increase just fell even further behind.
http://tinyurl.com/6nm4f5
Particularly amusing are the suggestions to increase taxes on small businesses or go to state income tax. Apparently Gregoire’s fresh out of ideas since she seems to be asking the public for suggestions …
If this works anything like it did with the Sonics situation, then the two phone calls to the Governor’s office saying create a new State income tax will count as 20,000 and the umpteen no phone calls will be pooh-poohed or or explained away.
November 19th, 2008 at 1:43 pm
http://moneycentral.msn.com/detail/stock_quote?Symbol=sbux
Today: Starbucks is only $8 per share.
This is quite a drop from $35/share in 2006 when Howard sold this city out.
At least, the econimic meltdown is good for somthing.
November 19th, 2008 at 1:47 pm
Early estimates on state proceeds from this $300M construction project are at $20M to the state general fund from sales tax and related expenses. So if they authorize the deal that is $20M in their pocket vs nothing if they don’t
November 19th, 2008 at 1:47 pm
Today: Starbucks is only $8 per share.
This is quite a drop from $35/share in 2006 when Howard sold this city out.
At least, the econimic meltdown is good for somthing
- Again…I don’t understand why everyone gets so excited for Starbucks to fail. Howard Schultz will never get hurt by Starbucks…will he lose money? Sure. But he will still always have much more money then we ever have.
On the other hand, Starbucks continuing to struggle means we could lose another large company that was based out of Seattle. Go ask the people at WAMU how they felt as their company’s stock price continued to fall…I’m sure it is alot worse then their CEO felt…
November 19th, 2008 at 3:08 pm
“- Again…I don’t understand why everyone gets so excited for Starbucks to fail. Howard Schultz will never get hurt by Starbucks…will he lose money? Sure. But he will still always have much more money then we ever have.”
That’s okay… there’s a lot that you clearly do not understand, like failing to see how there is significantly more Seattle in the Trailblazers than the Knicks. In the mean time, the lot of us will continue to root for the demise of McStarchucks and complete failure of its backstabbing, douchbag of a CEO.
Viva la Vivace!
November 19th, 2008 at 3:42 pm
“In the mean time, the lot of us will continue to root for the demise of McStarchucks and complete failure of its backstabbing, douchbag of a CEO.”
Good to see that you don’t give a rats ass about the rest of the city. Starbuck’s collapsing is a HUGE problem for Seattle. Much the same way that WAMU’s collapse will be strongly felt here soon.
I hope you’ve got a nice secure, job with a company on firm footing who will keep you around, because 20K leaving SB and 4200 leaving WAMU is just what this region needs.
On the other hand, I might get a nicer house of the the deal.
November 19th, 2008 at 4:01 pm
I dont need Starbucks to fail.. just Howard, Clay, Aubrey and T Boon pickens(why not) and the Thunder. besides Starbucks may go back up to $35, in a decade, as long as no one sells,your good.
OKC will have more economic problems then Seattle will. Besides, WAMU sucked. those bandits drank the alt-a, no income no assets Heloc koolaid. They should have been wiser, but noooooooo. They had to be witty hi[ and cool and give every 24 year old with a job a 500k home for no money down. thats their bad.
You can thank WAMU for lots of this economic trouble.
November 19th, 2008 at 4:05 pm
Sorry Off topic… Ray Allen is a class act and I hope all the older sonics help convince the NBA Seattle deserves a team..
I truly think that once Gary and Nate Mac-10 said there is no way I’m hanging my jersey in OKC the NBA took notice and the tides began to change.
November 19th, 2008 at 4:12 pm
“Good to see that you don’t give a rats ass about the rest of the city. Starbuck’s collapsing is a HUGE problem for Seattle. Much the same way that WAMU’s collapse will be strongly felt here soon.”
Actually, it isn’t. But then, I’ve been waiting (and continue to do so) for the fall of McCoffee for quite a while. Death to push button “espresso”! On a rational bright side, maybe WaMu and McCoffee’s downfalls will lead to less high-earning, anti-Sports imports from California wanting to move here and polluting Seattle’s housing market.
November 19th, 2008 at 4:23 pm
“Actually, it isn’t. But then, I’ve been waiting (and continue to do so) for the fall of McCoffee for quite a while. Death to push button “espresso”! On a rational bright side, maybe WaMu and McCoffee’s downfalls will lead to less high-earning, anti-Sports imports from California wanting to move here and polluting Seattle’s housing market.”
Thanks for proving my point
November 19th, 2008 at 4:30 pm
Wow, Scott getting mad, didn’t think I’d see that.
Question here, how viable can the Pistons be in Metro Detroit even with their ownership of the Palace as all of eastern Michigan is going to be in for a financial disaster that could cause massive flight from the area.
November 19th, 2008 at 4:34 pm
“Thanks for proving my point dipshit.”
Well, maybe Howard will fly to Washington on McStarchucks’ private jet and ask lawmakers for a bailout…
Viva La Vivace!
November 19th, 2008 at 4:35 pm
Clippers and OKC Thunder in OKC tonight…the battle of the teams with only 1 win each..
November 19th, 2008 at 4:36 pm
like Clipper Darryl says:
LETS GO CLIPPERS LETS GO!
LETS GO CLIPPERS LETS GO!
November 19th, 2008 at 4:36 pm
Scott should not be calling people derogative terms. I’ll talk to him about it.
November 19th, 2008 at 4:38 pm
my mistake, its actually CLIPPER DARRELL
did you know that Cuban wanted Clipper Darrell to be a fixture at Mavs home games? he even flew him out one time to Dallas, but he decided to remain in LA with his Clips
November 19th, 2008 at 5:03 pm
Zonics- Really Barney Frank, Maxine Waters, Chris Dodd and the rest of the gang deserve much of the blame along with WEAK Republicans who can’t communicate their concerns better and spend like drunken sailors. The housing meltdown was the lighter fluid to most of where we are at.
http://tinyurl.com/3nkrp7
November 19th, 2008 at 5:24 pm
http://www.nba.com/2008/news/features/art_garcia/11/19/111908garcia_westinsider/index.html
Ok ok.. blame Canada..
Interesting how if OKC moves out of the PNW div. that Memphis is SOL..
November 19th, 2008 at 5:25 pm
Those articles Brian posted are really alarming. It shows how the league is going to be in serious trouble as the season goes on. They have already cut back 10% of its staff in the league offices before the year began. I have a few ideas why this can be happening, aside from the financial and credit crisis.
-Faces of the team. Players are changing teams so often and owners threatening jobs if they dont win. In the last year or two with the Sonics, who could you associate yourself with? You can ask an average citizen who has been in Seattle for years and they could tell you at least Kemp, Payton, Perkins and Schrempf were members of the 1996 Finals team. Ask that same person who the starters were of the team last year, maybe they say Durant, but they dont have a clue besides him.
-Corporate taking over Die-hards. The game is focused more towards the corporations and business rather than the people who actually give a shit about the team. They are more concerned about who from Microsoft, Boeing, or Paccar are going to watch a game rather than getting the people who root and cheer and brag the team up to their buddies who are screaming from the upper deck getting the players attention. It’s become a corporate event.
-Average fan must plan to attend a game and sit in decent seats. Sure you can walk up and pay $10 and sit in the upper deck behind the hoop, but the people who go to blog sites, buy the merchandise, bring signs, etc arent the ones who can all afford to sit lower bowl between the baselines. Those are $69 and up. No wonder you have empty seats and rows on TV! The corporations dont care as much as the fans and just let the tickets go to waste. They get the tax deductible so its not much of a loss for them.
-Players complaining about contract when the nation is going through a financial disaster. Guys like Ben Gordon getting offered deals over his value, and still turning it down wanting more. Sorry Ben, you dont deserve that and nobody will give you pity.
-The league threatening cities. David Stern turned off thousands by talking shit about Seattle and constantly saying we didnt deserve a team and we must spend millions because they cant make enough money the way the arena is. No duh people dont like you Stern!
November 19th, 2008 at 5:26 pm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ADCz4pXYoVo&feature=related
November 19th, 2008 at 6:00 pm
just watching some NBA here tonight…flipped to the Raptors at Miami Heat and it looks like quite a few empty seats in the lower sections..
November 19th, 2008 at 7:04 pm
A POX ON STERN’S CABAL
November 19th, 2008 at 7:09 pm
So, when Mr Ballmer starts looking around for a team to put in Key Arena I guess it is fair to say that he will have a pick of many. Let’s put that part to rest.
Not only will there not be expansion, but contracting vs selling to Steve Ballmer will look like and easy decision.
I do not expect contraction, but I do expect more than one team changing owners and locations.
Now, how about that 300 million dollar construction project, that is half paid for by private money.
Yes Brian, have a talk with Scott, buy him a light beer, that will show him.
November 19th, 2008 at 7:12 pm
if more than half of the teams are losing money as the head toward a new contract for David Stern I just have to know what does it take to oust that guy.
November 19th, 2008 at 7:12 pm
I hope we get a team in two years…i don’t know if i can handle not having a team in Seattle for 5+ years…i may start forgetting about the NBA by then..
November 19th, 2008 at 7:18 pm
what the..im watching Clippers at OKC on KTLA and its in the second quarter 35-29 for the Thunder and CNNSI and ESPN.com show the game is 52-49 at the half, why is there a tape delay on KTLA?
November 19th, 2008 at 7:18 pm
not only do the Thunder have the worst Uniforms in the NBA they also have one terrible looking basketball court, so boring looking…
November 19th, 2008 at 7:40 pm
“Chris Paul might be the best PG to ever play the game…and yet does anyone really care?”–Myk.
Not yet. Magic, Payton, and Isaiah were all better to name a few.
You’re right about NBA apathy though. It’s hard to get behind a league willing to let any team move unless you are part of the big LA vs. Boston market.
IMPEACH STERN.
November 19th, 2008 at 8:02 pm
Good News!
Clippers up by 10 on the OKC Plunder in the 4th quarter
85-75 right now
November 19th, 2008 at 8:20 pm
I still give a lot of the blame for the collapse of the Sonics to Ray.
He bought into Wally Walker’s wish to be the “MAN” and was complicent in sending Nate out of town. Wally gave Ray the credit for the one good team (52 wins) rather than Nate. Wally saved about $3 mil with Weiss instead of Nate and hoped keeping Ray would continue the success.
We all know what happened.
The team collapsed. Fans left. Howard got pissed. He sold the team. Hello OKC.
What would have happened if Ray had of supported Nate instead of selling him out?
Screw Ray Allen. To Hell with Wally Walker.
November 19th, 2008 at 8:29 pm
“why is there a tape delay on KTLA?”
The Clippers and Lakers games are often — in fact usually — tape delayed so the broadcast starts at 5:30pm or later. Most people can’t watch the beginning of a game if it starts before 5pm. Even if one has a computer at work, most bosses would frown on the worker watching a basketball game.
November 19th, 2008 at 8:33 pm
Clips spank the Plunder on their own court by twenty. Life is sweet.
November 19th, 2008 at 8:34 pm
Ray is not to blame for Nate leaving. Paul Allen offered Nate more than Howard Schultz ever could.
Thunder lose to the Clippers 108-88 in OKC.
November 19th, 2008 at 8:35 pm
… guess that “Worst start evaaarr in a new city” is going to come to fruition. The Hornets surely won’t drop one against the Plunder. Welcome to the NBA, OKC!
November 19th, 2008 at 8:42 pm
ahh that explains it thanks,, too bad its not live..i already knew the half time score before watching the first half lol
November 19th, 2008 at 8:44 pm
Miriam-Webster’ s Definition:
Assunder-1:into parts
2: apart from each other in position
They keep losing and this team can be nicknamed the “OKC Asunder.”
November 19th, 2008 at 8:48 pm
OKC Torn Asunder
November 19th, 2008 at 8:53 pm
Chris “Elliot” Kaman laid 25 pts, 14 boards, 4 blocks on the Asunder. Swift needed all the help he could get.
November 19th, 2008 at 8:57 pm
Ray certainly did not fight FOR Nate, now did he?
And didn’t Howard end up paying as much for TWO HCs (Weiss-phal and Bungling Bob Hill about $2.5 mil each)???!!!
So we got rid of a popular coach, missed the playoffs, and sold the team. Nice planning. Go ahead and try to defend the idiots Wally and Howard.
We lost OUR SONICS you PUKING MORON!
November 19th, 2008 at 9:07 pm
OKC attendance: 18,310.
How long do they get away with lying about this?
May as well. They are all going bankrupt anyway.
November 19th, 2008 at 10:15 pm
I watched the LAC-OKC game on KTLA tonight. Definitely more than 1,000 empty seats. Also, I am almost certain Swift has the old Sonics logo (the one with the Seattle skyline) tattooed on his arm; is that new or has he always had that? Props to him if he got it as a tribute to his glorious career in Seattle.
November 19th, 2008 at 10:35 pm
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/features/worstteams
This is interesting. The Blunder are on a pace for the worst record ever (7-75) & they’re currently tied for the 4th worst start ever!
Definately takes away the sting a little.
November 19th, 2008 at 10:52 pm
Swift does have a tattoo of the old Sonics logo on his arm.
November 19th, 2008 at 11:08 pm
maybe on ESPN on Friday Night they can get th story behind the tattoo..ie the reason why swift has it, probably to remember and pay respects to the city he was drafted and played in?..thats my guess
November 20th, 2008 at 12:02 am
Thunder “fans” are already booing their home team. Un-f*cking-believable. Please, just put an end to this disaster and return the team to its rightful owners. We’ll pretend this whole relocation debacle never happened and everyone will be happy.
http://tinyurl.com/6my9mf
November 20th, 2008 at 12:11 am
Scott should not be calling people derogative terms. I’ll talk to him about it.
- Wow…really? You are actually gonna talk to Scott for being truthful and yet Clint still gets to show he has absolutely no understanding of how an economy or the world works.
Not sure why everyone has such a hard time understanding that these huge companies that fail in Seattle do 1000xs more damage to all of us then to the 5-10 people who are in charge of the companies. If you don’t get this simple fact you are an idiot…there isnt anything else that can be said about that.
I love how there are “anti-sports” people who you get mad at for not supporting your cause. You get mad because they are being selfish and not understanding that they are not supporting something that gives you happiness. Yet, you also publically cheer the downfall of companies that give THOUSANDS of jobs to our neighbors…that is essentially the most selfish thing you could do. Go talk to people who worked at WAMU that are waiting until December 31st to see if they will still have jobs. Ask them how much of the “give people bad loans” they were involved with.
Until then…shut the fu(k up…you are a complete waste of space.
November 20th, 2008 at 12:15 am
Not yet. Magic, Payton, and Isaiah were all better to name a few.
- Sure…compare Paul’s four years into the NBA to each of those player’s 10+ year careers and you will come out on the short end of the stick. Compare Paul’s statistics for the first four years to any of them (or even their best four year spans) and Paul is right up there with them.
If he continues to play at this same level for 6-8 more years AND has any sort of team success he will be the best PG ever.
November 20th, 2008 at 2:45 am
Just wanted to voice my opinion on the state of this blog. I don’t get why Clint is continually allowed to antagonize people here over and over. Each and every time I read a post of his, I consider giving up on this place. If he’s willing to comply and get along with others, fine. But if not, I see no difference from him and AK. At least AK tried talking basketball.
As for the current conversation about the state of the NBA. Myk or somebody hit the nail on the head. This is what you get when you market players over your teams. This is the exact reason the NFL is so strong. NFL teams have become like European soccer clubs. They are brands with rabid fan bases. Every NFL team could trade it’s most popular player and have it affect it’s following one bit. NFL fans view their team as a badge of honor. In the NBA this isn’t the case. Most NBA fans nowadays are LeBron fans or Kobe fans. Iverson gets traded to the Pistons, the Pistons just gained a bunch of new fans who don’t care about them, just one of their players. These types of fans aren’t what you build your business model around. They will not stay with you for very long, let alone during rough times. David Stern’s legacy is this pile of crap. Not riding on MJ’s coat tails.
November 20th, 2008 at 2:46 am
Why can’t I get a stinking post past moderation?!
November 20th, 2008 at 2:46 am
As for the current conversation about the state of the NBA. Myk or somebody hit the nail on the head. This is what you get when you market players over your teams. This is the exact reason the NFL is so strong. NFL teams have become like European soccer clubs. They are brands with rabid fan bases. Every NFL team could trade it’s most popular player and have it affect it’s following one bit. NFL fans view their team as a badge of honor. In the NBA this isn’t the case. Most NBA fans nowadays are LeBron fans or Kobe fans. Iverson gets traded to the Pistons, the Pistons just gained a bunch of new fans who don’t care about them, just one of their players. These types of fans aren’t what you build your business model around. They will not stay with you for very long, let alone during rough times. David Stern’s legacy is this pile of crap. Not riding on MJ’s coat tails.
November 20th, 2008 at 2:52 am
If all my posts eventually get through moderation, I apologize for the mess. Unfortunately with the filters on here, you have to play guess what’s blocking the post from going through. Not sure what it was I was saying that did it. But my main point was clint gets away with murder on this blog. His entire agenda is to start arguments. Don’t see how that’s cool with the people running this site.
November 20th, 2008 at 3:28 am
Frank Chopp and other legislators in Ballard/Fremont:
Host: Senator Jeanne Kohl-Welles
Location: Hale’s Ales in Ballard/Fremont
4301 Leary Way N.W., Seattle, WA US
View Map |
When: Thursday, November 20, 5:00PM
Phone: (206) 245-0708 (McKenna)
November 20th, 2008 at 5:59 am
Thanks. But I’d rather not go to that and have Chopp laugh in my face. I was picked on enough by bullies in high school.
Why is that clunt guy allowed to post on this site? he does nothing but try to get people agitated. not cool in my book and takes away from the site big time.
November 20th, 2008 at 6:47 am
It’s getting bad in OKC…….
http://www.newsok.com/a-first-for-thunder-boos/article/3323605
November 20th, 2008 at 6:53 am
“This is what you get when you market players over your teams.”
This is all pro sports in the US today due to MJ and Nike’s success of marketing the Jordan name.
I’m more familiar with the likes of Tom Brady, Bret Favre, Kevin Garnet, Ray Allen, Allen Iverson, Sydney Crosby, etc than I am with anything their teams of the past ever did. The US is a culture of “Me over We”, which is probably why this has been so popular of a marketing stragey.
Hopefully the Obama administation can pull our collective head out of our rear, and hammer home that we are all in this struggle together. Maybe then we’ll be able to focus more on the team play of a team like Davidson than the perfromance of a player like Stephen Curry.
Its an American ideological thing, not isolated to sports. And yes, its widely popular!
November 20th, 2008 at 7:06 am
I don’t care what people’s opinions are. Clint is almost always wrong in my opinion. What I don’t tolerate here is people calling others derogatory terms. Scott is a mod here and he needs to set an example, not get baited into acting like a 5 year old internet tough guy.
November 20th, 2008 at 7:29 am
CNNSI about the Thunder’s lack of well everything
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/writers/chris_mannix/11/19/thunder/index.html
November 20th, 2008 at 8:48 am
I would have boo’d too…9 straight losses..
November 20th, 2008 at 9:27 am
We all know what happened.
The team collapsed. Fans left. Howard got pissed. He sold the team. Hello OKC.
What would have happened if Ray had of supported Nate instead of selling him out?
LOL, classic Freespeech! Good to see you haven’t lost your paranoid streak after all these years. Thanks for the trip down memory lane, buddy. Say, how did you react on ring night when Ray hugged David Stern?
November 20th, 2008 at 9:31 am
We can we do to get as much OKC Plunder gear and shirts and signs into the hands of Blazer fans before the game in Portland?!?! Tickets?!?
November 20th, 2008 at 9:49 am
I’ll just let you guys figure this out from now on.
November 20th, 2008 at 10:02 am
Figure out what? Who the dipshit is, or why we should all go out and buy a triple grande?
November 20th, 2008 at 10:22 am
Yeah, stay classy, SonicsCentral. No need to resort to name calling…ad hominems weaken your arguments any way.
I don’t really have time to talk about this in fuller detail now, but anyone else see an NHL-style shutdown for the NBA coming on the horizon? It is going to need one colossal financial readjustment come new CBA time, and I don’t see how they resolve it without shutting down for a year. That New York Post article mentioned in one of these last couple of posts might have it a little more dire than it will be, but punching the reset button on the league might not be the worst idea.
So far, it has worked for the NHL, especially because they can yearly negotiate a new salary cap (which is probably going to need to come down for next season). It has made the league much more stable financially (although look for a team like the Florida Panthers or the Phoenix Coyotes to head back north in the next few years, and possibly Nashville as well, although they’re pretty much earmarked for Kansas City if they do relocate), which was necessary for the survival of the league.
The NBA seems to be following in their footsteps, financially. Ticket prices are way too high, because salaries are way too high…it’s unsustainable growth, a boom that is headed toward a bust. It’s like flying an airplane straight up…sooner or later, it will stall, and it looks like the NBA’s engine is just about to have its fuel cut off.
November 20th, 2008 at 11:20 am
The NBA seems to be following in their footsteps, financially. Ticket prices are way too high, because salaries are way too high…it’s unsustainable growth, a boom that is headed toward a bust. It’s like flying an airplane straight up…sooner or later, it will stall, and it looks like the NBA’s engine is just about to have its fuel cut off.
- The first sign of the validity of the NBA’s business model will be if the salary cap goes down next year. The fact that the salary cap increases every year and it is supposed to be tied to revenues seems to point to the fact that the NBA artifically (to a point) develops that numbers to make their entire business appear stronger than it really is…almost like companies that artificially inflate their stock prices.