RMR Day Two Summary
Posted on Sunday, July 16th, 2006 at 8:45 am by Brian Robinson
As has been the habit the last couple of days I’m writing this up in basically a blog format. Time constraints and multiple article requirements will force the more polished articles to come out through the next week so check back often. In addition to my commentary I will look to answer questions posed in the earlier threads. Feel free to ask other questions and I will get back to them later in the day.
The number one story of yesterday’s Sonics/Spurs game was the early struggles of Mo Sene who drew two fouls in his first thirty seconds of play. Story number two however is that after the game Big Mo spent time explaining to the trainers how the flu-like symptoms he had woken up with affected his game. Sene complained of a severe headache, dizziness, and a sore throat. He repeatedly coughed during our talk and appeared to have little or no energy. According to Sene these symptoms, combined with the altitude here in SLC made him feel exhausted and heavy just minutes into his warmup routine.
It will be interesting to see which of the first two games was an aberration for Sene. In game one he was quicker, more confident, and less tentative than should have been expected of a player so raw. In game two he began the night in the fashion I expected to see throughout the summer league. His reaction time was a split second slow and it seemed to take him an extra moment to process where he should be and how he should defend a play. While he still managed to block 4 shots(unofficially, the official box score only credited him with 2 but there was a consensus among myself and the Utah press that he CLEARLY had 4 total) the Spurs players seemed to sense his hesitation and went right at him.
Also struggling was Noel Felix who simply seemed tired. In game 1 Noel was excellent across the board and easily the teams best player. In game 2 he simply seemed a bit lethargic. He wasn’t bad at anything but was not good enough to take the ball away from the guards who were scoring fairly well.
Game 2 for the Sonics definitely featured more structured play with an effort to get the ball inside to Sene and run set plays. Andre Emmitt who led all scorers commented on the more structured game-play.
“We emphasized efficiency, running plays, just trying to get on the opposite side of it to make the defense play defense.” Emmitt said. “We definitely wanted to work on Mo. We wanted to give him that experience.”
Emmitt was the best player on the floor for the Sonics last night playing tough nosed defense and generally showing the athleticism that led to him being selected by the Sonics in the 2004 draft, where he was considered a borderline first round pick.
Also generally impressive were Ronnie Burell, an unheralded 6’9 swingman out of NC-Greenboro and Keith Langsford from Kansas. Neither player is likely to make the opening day roster but both probably have a chance to open some eyes and potentially earn a call up at some point in the next couple of season. Burell is particularly intriguing because of his length at his position. The emergence of lanky players like Tayshaun Prince and Boris Diaw has left the league somewhat intrigued by players with a long, disruptive body type and Burell may benefit from that fact. He is extremely active and athletically compared well to all the players there.
As mentioned in my earlier game-blog both Patch Morliende and Yotam Halperin were much improved from game 1. Halperin in particular showed both his strengths and weaknesses in a two minute stretch in the second quarter. He is smart and savvy, able to direct a team on offense and score just because he knows the game better than his competition. He is however very slow laterally and this makes it extremely difficult for him to defend the quick players in the NBA. On offense he appeared very susceptible to the trap because the defensive player can stay so tightly on him that he cannot find an easy exit pass. Most NBA players have enough quickness to move away from their defender and either create a little bit of daylight or draw a foul. In Halperin’s case his defender simply stuck with him like glue.
As for the other teams at the RMR I came away with a few thoughts. For starters Ronnie Brewer is going to be a damn fine player and he’s in a system which will maximize his talents. He was the guy I wanted Seattle to draft and I wouldn’t mind one bit having him on my team. The word active gets brought up a lot in summer league because, with the lack of structure sometimes the best way to judge a player is by how much they are moving, and how much sense they have of where to move to. Some players are active but out of control. Others, like Brewer are in constant motion and always getting to the right space to tighter the game up a bit. Brewer is active and he’s confident. Think of Desmond Mason with longer arms, the ability to handle the rock, and pass. He brings the same type of intensity that Desmond does but adds a lot more versatility. I believe he will be in contention for the Rookie of the Year award and likely finish top 5 or so in the voting.
Shelden Williams on the other hand did not show much at all. For two consecutive games he did not appear to be particularly good at much of anything and several NBA players commented on him while watching the game. Across the board there was disappointment that the 4 year senior did not look to be athletically superior to any of the assorted camp prospects gathered to play. Hiram Fuller out of Fresno State went toe to toe with Williams and it would have been impossible for the uninformed observer to tell you who the #5 overall pick in the draft was.
To further bash the woeful Hawks let me say that Marvin Williams also does not impress me. Williams had a great stat line with 30 points and 10 rebounds but it was the most unimpressive 30/10 outing I could have imagined. Williams has a lack of body control that is startling. His shoulders slump and his arms hang limp throughout the game. While his physical talents are amazing I think that this “imprecise movement” for lack of a better term will always make him a marginal player. Compare him to Brewer, who always seems to have a sense of exactly where his hands are and it just appears that he may never have the physical discipline to be a star player.
The highlight of the Atlanta/Dallas game occurred at the start of overtime when the assembled Jazz Roster sat at the end-line watching. “It’s Stoudamire time baby!” People were shouting in reference to second year guard Salim Stoudamire, “Overtime is Stoudamire time”. Stoudamire came out of the gate handling the ball and immediately rolled off a pick by Marvin Williams. At the time he gained enough space that he easily could have taken a three point shot. Almost as if it was in slow motion you could see Stoudamire think about the shot, consider it, and his body just naturally started the motion. However Stoudamire, likely aware that he must play the PG position to make it in the league switched to a pass to Williams that was easily picked off and run back by Dallas. I probably cannot do this scene justice with words but let me say it was the most amazing example of conscious thought trying to fight physical instinct that I have ever seen. For a moment it appeared as if Stoudamire had strained his back by fighting his body’s natural motion too hard.
Q&A
Is Sene a good defender ?
I know he is a tremendous shotblocker but is he, like Dalembert, just an average defender ?
Because i noticed that the players matched up with Sene had big games (Randolph and Mahinmi)
I think the answer to that is yes, conditionally. I keep coming back to Sene’s instincts which appear to be really good. Right now he is playing 100% on instincts and players are taking advantage of it. They lure him out to cover and then catch him off guard. What should be noted is that Randolph is a guy with league experience and Mahinmi has several years of professional experience in Europe. One thing that is REALLY apperent when watching summer league is how much of a difference big-league experience makes. Guys who’ve played in either the NBA or upper-echelon european teams are simply more accustomed to the speed, etc. and dominate. DJ Mbenga is a great example. You would think the guy is Hakeem the way he dominates other players at his position. I think it was this experience that allowed them to excel against him. The guys with less experience were stonewalled by the 7 footer. His shotblocking has a big impact on the smaller players trying to penetrate the lane so it is safe to say that he makes a defensive impact.
I heard that Ridnour and Swift have a crasy look now !
Swift has a shaggy look and 4-5(he honestly didn’t know how many) new tattoo’s since the season ended. Big ones on his arms that go all the way down his body. He actually looks better. Ridnour shaved his head skinhead style and reportedly looks like a nut. My sister may be suicidal if he doesn’t grow it back by the time the season starts.
It is way way early but it was mentioned in the game 1 comments that Philly adjusted to Sene’s early success by using Randolph at center and I presume luring Sene out further from paint and taking jumpers or driving by. Will NBA coaches make this a main strategy when he is in the game? Or just try to beat him with some combo of footwork, muscle, pumpfakes and other basketball smarts?
I don’t want to be too hard on assistant Ralph Lewis who is coaching these games, but in general it has seemed to me that every team I’ve watched has been more structured and coached than the Sonics. I’m honestly not sure what to make of it but the team simply doesn’t seem to make any adjustments during the game. Our bench has only Lewis (1 year NBA and D-League), Sikma(2 years NBA), Schrempf(1/2 year NBA), and Bob Hill’s oldest son (nanda) so there is some really limited experience as far as coaching goes. If I had to name the biggest disappointment with the summer league the coaching of the Sonics would be it. I just am not sure exactly what they are doing.
Anybody other than Robert (of the main rotation guys) at RMR Brian?
Nope. I’m not sure why Robert is really there except that he is a hoops junkie. He wants to play and says that he is asking Rick Sund every day, hoping to break him down. Apparently the Sonics don’t really like 3rd year players to play in the Summer League unless they are trying to make the team. They know what they have with Swift. Robert is really putting in the time. I’ll have an article up about him later this week with lots of good quoted but he basically says that if he doesn’t have a breakout season this year “it won’t be because I didn’t do everything in my power to improve. I don’t want to ever think that there was one more thing I could have done, to work harder that prevented me from making it.” He will go back to Seattle for the month of July and work with the team, then leave for Las Vegas to train with Tim Grgrich before returning for training camp. Basically he took about a week off this summer.
Between Felix and Burrell who has been playing (or guarding) SF and PF?
Felix has been at the 4 exclusively. We are a little undermanned at the 3 and have played some three-guard lineups.
Langford 18 freethrow attempts in 2 games. Good drives? Freelancing or within the flow of what they were running?
Keith Langford has been really impressive. He knows his shots and doesn’t try to exceed his range. Almost all of his scoring has been 12-15 foot jumpers off screens. He hits them so consistently that when he decides to drive instead he can draw the foul well.
July 16th, 2006 at 9:00 am
Thanks for the answers !
July 16th, 2006 at 9:01 am
Shawn - We would love updates from the French National games. Can you e-mail me with a schedule and I’ll set you up as a writer.
July 16th, 2006 at 9:03 am
wow a writer ?
I don’t know if my english is good enough ?
July 16th, 2006 at 10:48 am
Props, good stuff Brian!
The excerpt about Salim had me laughing in my seat- truly funny stuff.
Shawn, you could always just write in French…I wouldn’t mind
July 16th, 2006 at 12:01 pm
YOU CAN DO IT SHAWN!!! We need your colums from the games! Just bring no bias..lol.
July 16th, 2006 at 1:37 pm
I will try !
But the World Championship is not available on US TV ? this is very strange !
July 16th, 2006 at 1:38 pm
Imagine if Brewer was on our team… he could end up being a better Antonio Daniels.
July 16th, 2006 at 1:54 pm
The World Championship will be on TV in the US. I talked to someone at FIBA last month and the broadcast contracts aren’t done yet, but according to them most of them should be on. And FIBA.com will broadcast some on the internet too.
July 16th, 2006 at 2:15 pm
Ok
So do you still need my work ?
July 16th, 2006 at 2:27 pm
France games are at 7pm in japan
That means 11am in France and 2am in Seattle (If I didn’t make a mistake calculating
)
July 16th, 2006 at 2:42 pm
Excellent info Brian, much appreciated, as always.
July 16th, 2006 at 2:52 pm
“Imagine if Brewer was on our team…”
My guess is that right now we’d all be saying ‘imagine if Sene was on our team’.
“he could end up being a better Antonio Daniels.”
He could end up being better than Dikembe Mutombo.
But I’m just being cynical:P
July 16th, 2006 at 3:07 pm
Except Brewer probably can’t play point.
If he had a solid jump shot I would have loved to have him on the team. The games I saw him play he would pass up wide open jump shots. Not to say it wouldn’t be nice to have someone attack the basket, but if teams don’t respect your jump shot it’s pretty difficult to do well.
July 16th, 2006 at 3:54 pm
While I defended the Sene pick, I was pushing for Brewer the whole way, and he would make sense even if Gelabale and Wilkins beat him out in triaing camp, because it’s likely we won’t carry a third PG. His only downside would be his jumper, and there aren’t a whole lot of guards out there who became premiere players without a jumper, not to say there aren’t any.
Brian, from your objective view, and having watched several games already, what do you think Robert or Johan would be doing in the RMR? I just want your first inclination as to what they’d do.
July 16th, 2006 at 5:12 pm
It seems to me that any player with NBA experience has a huge edge. The big thing about the NBA is growing accustomed to the speed and overall atheletic ability. In the summer league it is a step down. Rafael Araujo is able to push people around, as is DJ Mbenga who is pretty dominant at this level. I think Robert and Petro would do well for that reason.
July 16th, 2006 at 5:57 pm
I’m pretty sure that if we had not drafted Sene none of us would even be talking about him, since he was barely on our radar as a player
July 16th, 2006 at 6:27 pm
Sene was on our radar. (He was my choice on draft day and Brian predicted the pick 4 months before) And while I haven’t seen either of them play I would still assume that Sene has the higher ceiling as a player.
What do you think Brian, who has more potential?
If it’s Sene, then since Brewer wouldn’t beat out Wilk or Lil John this year or probably next year I still think its a good pick. No point in drafting a guy that’s ceiling is a bottom of the rotation guy when you can draft someone who has the potential to be great.
Turn this around another way, Who will be paid more when they get out of their rookie contract, Sene or Brewer….
July 16th, 2006 at 6:31 pm
I dont know if its possible but you should look at putting one of your articles up on this site Brian…
http://www.nba.com/jazz/Revue/2006_News_from_the_Revue.html
Utah has 5 artilcles and Phili has one while its just blank under the Sonics…
July 16th, 2006 at 7:11 pm
Saying that Brewers’ ceiling is what D-Wilks or Gelabale is now isn’t really fair to Brewer as a player, because he clearly hasn’t had any shot in the NBA as of yet. Same with Gelabale, also considering he hasn’t played against much American competition.
If Brewer can really handle the ball well, make solid decisions on offense, and play hard nosed team defense, he can find a nitch in this league, and I betcha if his jumper improves just the slightest, he’ll be something more then a fringe backup.
I think the World Championships have potential to be fun this year, and I’ll totally be rooting for France.
July 16th, 2006 at 8:09 pm
Nice pics, Brian. I like Swifty’s new look :p
July 16th, 2006 at 8:24 pm
I thinks it’s obvious that a 7′ Center will always carry a higher price tag than a versatile swingman. I don’t doubt that Brewer is talented and will be a fine player, but he is redundant on our squad once we signed Gelabale.
July 16th, 2006 at 8:24 pm
I’m with you mk, and i have seen very little of Brewer, but my impressions pre-draft were that he would probably never be a quality starter for any nba team (now of course if a team is cmpletely deficient at his position he will start, but thats not being a quality starter.)
Sene has that chance to be great but this debate is old… We will know in a couple years if we made the right decision.
GO FRANCE!!!
July 16th, 2006 at 8:35 pm
“I’m with you mk, and i have seen very little of Brewer, but my impressions pre-draft were that he would probably never be a quality starter for any nba team”
No idea why you’d feel this way, he supposedly plays great D, handles the ball well, shoots okay, slashes well and has good court awareness.
He could end up being an all-star some day or he could end up being Reece Gaines… While the 7 footer will always have more of an upside in the end, I see no reason why Brewer couldn’t beat out Gelabale and Wilkens for the 2/3 backup role if we had drafted him.
July 16th, 2006 at 9:07 pm
Damien Wilkins wouldn’t have been a first round pick in this draft and Gelbale would have been drafted after Brewer so how can we say that we think he won’t even live up to their play. Gelbale sure has a good reputation considering none of us seen him play at all.
As for the commodity factor, there is a sliding scale in terms of success. Sene has a 10% chance of greatness, 40% chance of being decent and 50% chance of a bust. Brewer may have a 5% chance of being decent but based on the write up it sound like he has about a 75% chance of being decent and 25% chance of being a bust. Its not always bad to go with the safe call.
Finally, how come Brewer is redundant (although clearly better than what we have seen from our back up guys) and Sene is not? If Swift is focusing this hard on his game it sounds like Sene might be redundant as well with Swift playing 30-35mpg.
July 16th, 2006 at 9:27 pm
“Damien Wilkins wouldn’t have been a first round pick in this draft and Gelbale would have been drafted after Brewer so how can we say that we think he won’t even live up to their play.”
How do you know either of these things? These are purely your assumptions of the situation.
There’s only one set of people who were able to work out all three guys and they passed on Brewer.
July 16th, 2006 at 9:38 pm
Is Seattle seriously considering Deng? I could not believe it when I saw his name on the initial summer league roster. This guy might be tall but he has proved to the world that he has neither the mental nor physical aptitude to play in NBA. Does he understand that height is just the part of the equation? His games and stats (outside of college) are mediocre. I hope I will not find myself spending my entire season tkts watching mediocre players
He had several chances for pro ball and he blew them all!!!
I don’t think he understands what NBA is about and I hope we do not make the mistake of picking him. I don’t think it is a risk worth considering.
Talking about his knee. Couldn’t he have worked on it during the summer? C’mon. I am sure he could have done s’thing about it before coming to Seattle.
July 16th, 2006 at 10:36 pm
It is a long time til training camp. If he isnt right at the monent there is still plenty of time to evaluate.
He has been out of college 14 months.
He was a late cut in Philly last year, even playing a few minutes in regular season.
An article on him
http://tinyurl.com/ec2gp
July 16th, 2006 at 10:50 pm
3 time conference defensive player of the year and a strong blocker.
I see injuries were an issue last year too but I dont have enough information on what type of issue.
They felt he was one of 15 guys worth taking a look at.
Different from his brother but perhaps that adds to the interest a little.
To make team he will have to get healthy and play very well.
I hope he gets right for a shot at it.
July 16th, 2006 at 10:54 pm
Lead all rookie in blocks during preseason last year.
And apparently was top 10 in college history at blocks.
A power forward possibilty.
Perhaps if Wilcox moves.
July 16th, 2006 at 10:54 pm
Deng Gai has no chance at being on the team… none… our front line is set… so no worrys
July 16th, 2006 at 10:56 pm
On Brewer… Like I said earlier…
“Who will be paid more when they get out of their rookie contract, Sene or Brewer….”
Is that not a fair arguement? As Locke, the FO, and many people on this board have been saying Sene is more of an asset, which is why he is projected to get more money then Brewer in a couple years (IMO)… I would say money has a direct link to worth…
July 16th, 2006 at 10:57 pm
“how come Brewer is redundant (although clearly better than what we have seen from our back up guys) and Sene is not?”
Brewer is redundant because we have Ray Allen and Rashard Lewis both playing 35 min a night a least. And already 3 backups for them (Earl will play a lot of 2 this year I think).
The only way picking Brewer makes any sense to me is if we trade Rashard and not Swift or Petro and dont get a SF back… pretty doubtful I would say…
Brewer seems a lot more like Wilk and Gelabale then Sene is like Petro and Swift. Brewer is not known for his 3pt shot, he is a slasher with good D; that sounds EXACTLY like Gelabale and Wilk. Sene is raw offensively and a shot blocker while I would Say Petro and Swift’s D need a lot of work while their offense is pretty developed for 20 year old post players.
So for the math… Sene, Swift and Petro are fighting for AT LEAST 48 minutes (we might put one at PF once and a while) while Gelabale Wilk and Brewer would be fighting for AT MOST 26 minutes (13 min of back up at SG and SF and then Earl will take some minutes too).
And Sene is even less be redundant when we lose Petro/Swift to Free Agency or trade one of them. I think we could get a very high return for Petro/Swift next year. If we package Petro/Swift with wilcox or lewis or someone like that Sene will come in handy…
I think we should trade Petro over Swift… but then again I love my “Vote for Petro” T-shirt
July 16th, 2006 at 10:58 pm
“Deng Gai has no chance at being on the team… none… our front line is set… so no worrys”
That’s a very suprising statement as the key to our frontline hasn’t inked his name on any papers..
“As for the commodity factor, there is a sliding scale in terms of success. Sene has a 10% chance of greatness, 40% chance of being decent and 50% chance of a bust. Brewer may have a 5% chance of being decent but based on the write up it sound like he has about a 75% chance of being decent and 25% chance of being a bust. Its not always bad to go with the safe call.”
You’re willing to call someone on assumptions…and follow it up with a paragraph that has no factual basis whatsoever and is complete based on your opinion?
O-K..
July 16th, 2006 at 10:58 pm
Deng Gai may just be cousins with Luol.
Nephew on Manute Bol.
Shot 150 3 pointers in college and made 33%.
Played CBA last season
July 16th, 2006 at 11:00 pm
“A power forward possibilty.
Perhaps if Wilcox moves.”
Perhaps.. but i think its more likely we just needed a big guy on the summer league roster and hes 6′9 250ish so he fits the bill.
July 16th, 2006 at 11:08 pm
not sure on play in CBA. he was “drafted”
July 16th, 2006 at 11:25 pm
sure. I was just taking the opportunity to see what could be said positive about him.
deng played usbl dodge city this spring. had a 7 block game.
July 16th, 2006 at 11:29 pm
Deng Gai hurt his knee and isn’t playing.
Sene is god. Go ahead, dispute it…. If you like being hit with lightning bolts and getting warts on your balls.
Aux Champs Elysees! Aux Champs Elysees!
Au Soleil, sous la pluit!
A midi, ou a minuit!
Il y a ce que vous voulez Aux Champs Eylsees!
July 16th, 2006 at 11:31 pm
6pts 7 rebs 2 blocks 1 turnover per game in 8 games
July 16th, 2006 at 11:40 pm
Appears last played there in early may.
I had mild interest in him as a possible second round pick last year or camp invite.
Had a leg injury junior year but came back and played all 30 games as a senior.
July 16th, 2006 at 11:41 pm
Deng Gai maybe see ya in october. good luck anyways.
July 17th, 2006 at 5:24 am
I saw Deng in Detroit this weekend and I don’t think he is doing much. The difference between Deng and other players in his class is that other players (even those younger than him) exhibit a sense of responsibility. Deng, I really can’t count on him. I saw him in Philly and I can tell you.
He might have done great in college but this guy is wasted. He needs to spend more time in D-league and get his focus right. He can block and all but each year we see more talent entering the playing field. Therefore, the contest goes beyond blocking. We need to factor in responsibility, maturity, business sense and dedication.
July 17th, 2006 at 5:31 am
France is playing Tonight against Switzerland to prepare for the World Championship
I won’t see the game (not available on TV) but i’ll try to give you the stats.
I’m not sure Gelabale will be playing as he just came back from Seattle…
July 17th, 2006 at 8:07 am
Are we trying to pull a sympathy card for Deng Gai by putting up stories about his refugee trail? Please, give the world a break. The last time I checked NBA might be benevolent but not a non-profit. There are millions of refugees in the U.S alone and they would do whatever it takes to succeed. 14 months out of college and nothing to show. Speaks millions about his dedication to his dream.
A person like Deng needs to be reminded of the fact that the talent pool is getting better each year and Global borders have been dismantled. He is not competing against U.S players any more. So he needs to step up if he thinks he deserves a chance.
I agree. Sene is god and he will deliver. He definitely exhibits the drive and hunger that NBA needs.
July 17th, 2006 at 8:17 am
Tara, no worries. Our front line is set with Wilcox, Nick, Mikki, Petro, Swift, Sene, and maybe a couple min from Felix. Gai has no chance at making the team.
July 17th, 2006 at 8:29 am
Deng Gai has no shot at making this team other than a 10-day contract in disastrous circumstances.
“I see no reason why Brewer couldn’t beat out Gelabale and Wilkens for the 2/3 backup role if we had drafted him. ”
How do you figure that? Every rookie the Sonics has drafted in the last 4 or 5 years has had mostly token minutes his first year — Petro’s been the only exception. The franchise seems to really, really like Damien … I don’t think there’s any way Brewer would have beat out both those guys unless he was the second coming of Dwane Wade in camp.
July 17th, 2006 at 8:44 am
“How do you figure that? Every rookie the Sonics has drafted in the last 4 or 5 years has had mostly token minutes his first year”
I see no reason Brewer couldn’t have beaten them out. He has all the tools to be a better player than Wilkens… not sure about Gelabale.
I’m not seeing he would’ve beat them out, and sure… we can assume he’d only get token minutes based on previous rookies getting the same (except things are a bit different under Hill than previous coaches).
“I don’t think there’s any way Brewer would have beat out both those guys unless he was the second coming of Dwane Wade in camp.”
That’s the thing… nobody knows if he’s going to blow up like Wade or not… just like none of us know of Sene will turn out like Mutumbo. So to assume there’s no way he’d beat out Wilkens and Gelabale is wrong. It’s possible he could have and it’s possible that he plays so well that we would’ve traded Lewis to make room for him at SF.
You just never know….
July 17th, 2006 at 8:52 am
Like a good number of Sonics fans, I had Ronnie Brewer at the top of the list of players that would probably still be on the board when Seattle picked and thought he was the best choice.
But I also said that in a draft like this one I would feel comfortable with whoever Seattle selected since there wasn’t one big glaring hole to fill. So if Brewer does turn out to be a rookie of the year candidate and Sene progresses slowly, it’s water under the bridge and hindsight isn’t going to add to much other than fans saying whatif. I’m sure we’ll see our share of ” I told you so” posters.
I’ve been watching alot of summer league games(in Canada I subscribe to Raptors TV, a dedicated basketball channel that covers almost all the games), mostly from the Vegas league, and if you’re talking about a power forward prospect that can block shots, I’ll direct you to keeping an eye on Justin Williams, who is playing for the Kings. Although not physically like Sene, he has that presence about him like a Ben Wallace(he’s about the same size) that he’s always around the ball on the defensive end of the rim and either blocks or makes players alter their shots. I’ve been impressed by him.
July 17th, 2006 at 10:03 am
Tara if Gai wasnt in Salt Lake City and likely was going to fade away unnoticed why did you feel a need to go harsh on him? If it was purely basketball assessment ok fine. It seems like a little suspicious something else might be involved so I stuck up for Gai.
Gai is worthless and Sene at 3 inches taller is great? Tara have you seen Sene play? How much? In what ways other than size is he better?
Yes they play different positions but seems like a weird double standard. Which is another reason I stuck up for Gai. Gai has more experience, more good games on his resume, and maybe more offense right now. Is he going to make the team here? No, Not unless Wilcox moves. What is the chance of that? This summer? Maybe 20-40% at most.
But whatever.
July 17th, 2006 at 10:28 am
“It’s possible he could have and it’s possible that he plays so well that we would’ve traded Lewis to make room for him at SF.
You just never know…. ”
Agreed Doobs … but that’s a far cry from
“I see no reason why Brewer couldn’t beat out Gelabale and Wilkens for the 2/3 backup role if we had drafted him. ”
Just sayin’.
Utah seems a good match for Brewer. He’s one guy to watch this year … Brian thinks he’ll be in contention for ROY.
July 17th, 2006 at 10:37 am
Sene has drive and hunger…
The signs may be good but it is based on 2 summer games (or rather small stretches of them), a few practices and workouts and 11 minutes a game in Belgium. Hope the cold goes away and he gets more run in Salt Lake.
Gai’s pretty solid 4 years at a low ranked program isnt that impressive but it isnt nothing either. Coming back from injury junior year and playing well in every game as a senior doesnt sound like somebody with no work ethic or a guy who thinks something should be handed to him.
But I dont know him.
July 17th, 2006 at 10:37 am
Sorry for bringing up my opinion guys.
I mean personally if I am building a team I don’t want to have to rely on my back up PG (who is small and really not that great of a shooter) to also play 8 or so minutes a night at the SG spot.
Also, I have a SF who could opt-out of his contract and there was a guy on the board that was rated by “most people” as a better prospect then the two guys we have to play behind him.
Finally, we have a young 20 year old Center who is working hard over the summer to become a complete player and if he had wanted to play in the Summer League I would’ve let him because I would rather continue to develop a 20 year old who is showing great progress then have him sit out to help develop another guy who might be redundant if the guy I already have ends up being as good as we think he can be.
July 17th, 2006 at 10:40 am
I’m with DK on this one.
I had the Sonics selecting Brewer and was excited about his potential; when they took Sene, I was stunned.
Seattle needs defense bad, but I thought they needed perimeter defense so Sene was a strange pick.
However, his physical and athletic attributes are intriguing and I’m willing to give the FO the benefit of the doubt because they’re seeing something that could be potentially special and that’s not always available with the 10th pick.
It’s now interesting that we were so tied into a divisional opponent on draft day. We couldn’t move around much because we knew Utah wanted Sene, but yet we probably had Brewer rated pretty high on our board as did Utah, obviously.
July 17th, 2006 at 11:01 am
“Finally, we have a young 20 year old Center who is working hard over the summer to become a complete player and if he had wanted to play in the Summer League I would’ve let him because I would rather continue to develop a 20 year old who is showing great progress then have him sit out to help develop another guy who might be redundant if the guy I already have ends up being as good as we think he can be.”
I think I would have held Robert out of Summer League. Not that I don’t appreciate him being there and trying to get some run in, but there’s just too many guys trying to make a name for themselves and the games are way to hap-hazard for the structured game Robert has.
“Also, I have a SF who could opt-out of his contract and there was a guy on the board that was rated by “most people” as a better prospect then the two guys we have to play behind him.”
I know you don’t wanna buy this arguement but if the Sonics decided to try to move either Petro or Swift I think you’d be stunned by the value they’d bring back in trade. Outside of Lebron, Chris Paul, D Wade and possibly Melo I think you could get any swingman in the last five drafts for Rob.
The other reason I don’t worry too much about Lewis and opting out is how many teams who would be interested in him will have space available next off-season? I think if you look around the league teams have needs at the 5 and 1. New Orleans used all thier available space, Charlotte has Wallace and Morrison, Atlanta’s got a ton of swingmen (most of whom would interest me in a sign and trade scenerio).
July 17th, 2006 at 11:14 am
“Finally, we have a young 20 year old Center who is working hard over the summer to become a complete player and if he had wanted to play in the Summer League I would’ve let him because I would rather continue to develop a 20 year old who is showing great progress then have him sit out to help develop another guy who might be redundant if the guy I already have ends up being as good as we think he can be.”
Given that the summer league is as guard-centric as reported and probably not nearly as important for big men (or anyone) as, say, training camp, I’m guessing it’s not hurting Swift’s development too badly, whereas that floor time is probably worth a lot more for Sene, who’s at a different stage of development than Swift. My sense that the value of summer league isn’t quite as you imagine it or wish it to be for the sake of your argument. Your argument that these guys are going to hurt each other’s development makes no sense. Swift isn’t playing in the summer league therefore the team’s disinterested in or has given up on his development? Wha’? Given that Brewer would have as many players ahead of him at his position you wanted him instead why? These guys are going to be playing against each other and learning from each other in practice and if they’ve been at all dedicated they’ve been working in the off season. If we only had one of Swift and Petro I expect Sene’s minutes would be almost as minimal in the coming year as they in fact will be. He’ll be eased into his role. All three bigs might pan out. If they do, we’ll have happy hard decisions to make with those assets.
July 17th, 2006 at 11:17 am
Tara, I went into skeptical mode but I’ll step back and ask about your observations on Gai. You dont have to if you want to drop it.
You said you saw him in Detroit. It that where he lives now or were you both there for some event? Did you talk to him or have you? Do have insider conections that you base your comments about his work ethic on? You saw his Philly preseason games last year, one or two or all of them? And you are in Seattle now? Any ties to other Sonic players?
I started skeptical but I am open to giving your opinions more weight if I understood them better. I did see one internet comment that his Philly training camp wasnt great.
July 17th, 2006 at 11:28 am
“Also, I have a SF who could opt-out of his contract and there was a guy on the board that was rated by “most people” as a better prospect then the two guys we have to play behind him.”
Just a guess…
Lewis said a few weeks ago that he wants to extend his contract two years beyond the end of his current deal. He could opt out next summer, or he could not opt out and his contract runs through 2009, and if he can extend it two years to 2011 then he would be at the end of the current CMA.
http://members.cox.net/lmcoon/salarycap.htm#5
Why would he want to be a FA in 2011? Ask LaBron.
In short, Lewis isn’t opting out and will likely sign for two more years at the end of this summer.
He signed his current deal on 9/19/02, he can extend his deal then.
“A six or seven year contract can be extended when at least four years have passed since the signing of the contract. ”
http://members.cox.net/lmcoon/salarycap.htm#51
July 17th, 2006 at 11:50 am
— It would be interesting to see what Swift/Petro/Sene’s true trade value would be. I know that is impossible to quantify. However, it seems that we really think a great deal of our young big men and yet as stated in a thread ealier neither Swift or Petro have played in the Rookie/Soph game. Petro despite what we claim as having a good season didn’t even get a vote for the All Rookie Team.
I don’t doubt that they should be valuable, however, for as good as us fans claim they are its not like the national guys are talking about what a great young front line we have here in Seattle. In fact most people claim that our front line is a weakness…
Let me be clear: I am not necessarily agreeing with the national perspective. However, it is worth noting.
July 17th, 2006 at 12:11 pm
Found a few words from Deng Gai himself on the net.
Patterns himself on Ben Wallace and Bill Russell.
Sneakiness as part of blocking success is a sign of basketball smarts.
Put on 35 pounds in weight room in final years of college.
http://www.nba.com/knicks/news/modelworkout_050617.html
Elsewhere his college coach, as they will talk, at draft guessed his best basketball was 3 years away with a very high ceiling.
It might be but this next year or two obviously can go either way- success or obscurity.
October camp wherever, if anywhere, might be his last best shot.
July 17th, 2006 at 12:28 pm
It is a weakness right now… but thats because they are 20 years old and still suck! But ask a person like Pendergraft and they would be very interrested in our bigs because of their POTENTIAL to be great one day, not their stats last season.
July 17th, 2006 at 12:29 pm
In the middle of the 4th quarter France is leading 68-47 against Switzerland
Gelabale is not playing and Petro almost didn’t play with just 1 rebound
July 17th, 2006 at 12:30 pm
Thx for the update… Do you knwo why Petro didn’t play, I thought he was a starter?
July 17th, 2006 at 12:34 pm
He is not a starter for the moment and I don’t think he will be a starter for the world Championship
Weis (the guy drafted by the Knicks
) has much more experience and is a better fit with FIBA rules.
In this game star players don’t play much, the coach is looking to find the players that will end the rotation
July 17th, 2006 at 12:38 pm
The problem with the whole “Brewer vs. Sene” question is that the Sonics and this draft have unusual characteristics for a #10pick.
1. The Sonics believe that they have every rotation spot filled to their content (perhaps foolishly, seeing as this team has the #10 pick…) so they didn’t feel the need to go after a ready to contribute wing (brewer), point (williams), or mediocre big man (armstrong).
2. While it seems obvious that the Sonics have a lot of needs, the fact us that this is a weak draft and the #10 pick isn’t going to net you a likely ROY candidate or franchise cornerstone. The draft was so weak that the chance that new player could crack the rotation is very unlikely in management (and more importantly Bob Hill’s) mind.
3. We know nothing about Gelabale and Wilkens hasn’t been anything more than mediocre and inconsistent in a sub role. The club is trusting 20 mins or so with these two, when perhaps a toough nosed slasher, passer who REALLY DOES play hard D like Brewer is really what we needed. But FO obviously felt that the 2nd round pick and Damien’s contract were commitments that Brewer couldn’t get past.
4. We need a true interior defender in order to contend for a title anytime in the next 10 years, so drafting Sene takes a chance that may pay off huge in the future, cause if Robert Swift can get to 260 in 2 years, think what a man beast Sene can become. Also, it fits managment’s new idea of drafting high ceiling big men who will have huge value to avoid overpaying mediocre (or straight up crappy Dampier style) centers.
The main argument comes down to whether you think we should’ve taken a role player to make our team better right now, because we obviously need improvement, or taken a big man who could be great because we had no holes to fill with a ready to go player.
The truth as always, lies somewhere in the middle probably…
They really shouldn’t feel so confident with this team in the West especially, but come on!
Now we get to see “Shake them Dreads” play, and Sene can touch the rim without jumping! YEAHHHHH!!!!
July 17th, 2006 at 12:38 pm
77 - 47, 4 min left in the 4th
Diaw with 9 points (4/5) 4 rebounds and 2 blocks
Parker : 10 points (3/6) 6 assists and 6 TOs
July 17th, 2006 at 12:39 pm
I looked for past summer league stats but could not find them.
But the Sonics would have them along with his performance at 2 draft camps. Apparently they had some interest.
If Brian had a chance to ask Coach Hill if he was personally interested in him and played a role in the invite and if he will be back later that would clarify whether it is worth talking about. (I could see interest perhaps from Gordy with his Utah defense is important background too.)
July 17th, 2006 at 12:46 pm
To broaden and get back to who is in Salt Lake City,
how has Ronnie Burrell’s defense been? Felix’s? Any of the perimeter players stand above the others on defense?
July 17th, 2006 at 12:47 pm
Frederic Weis is better known over here for being dunked on by Vince Carter.
July 17th, 2006 at 12:55 pm
The Game is over
France won 84 - 56
Mike Pietrus, Gelabale and Turiaf didn’t play
Petro with 3 rebounds 1 steal and 2 fouls (he didn’t shot) in about 10 minutes
Parker with 11 points (3/7) 7 assists 2 steals and 6 turnovers
Diaw with 13 points (6/8) 2 rebounds 4 assists (I made a mistake in my previous post) 2 steals and 2 blocks
July 17th, 2006 at 12:55 pm
I got two posts under moderation
July 17th, 2006 at 12:57 pm
“Frederic Weis is better known over here for being dunked on by Vince Carter”
I always hated this guy but he has been playing better recently. he was very good in the European Championship and is one of the best defensive center in Europe
July 17th, 2006 at 1:05 pm
“Brian thinks he’ll be in contention for ROY.”
I don’t think that’s a far cry from:
“I see no reason why Brewer couldn’t beat out Gelabale and Wilkens for the 2/3 backup role if we had drafted him.”
Honestly, I see no reason why Brewer couldn’t win that job. To win ROY he’ll likely have to play starter’s minutes on the Jazz (most ROY winners start if not all) who have Harpring at the 2 and Kirilenko at the 3. Beating out Harpring is going to be harder than beating out Wilkens/Gelabale.
He has the tools, he could’ve been a top 5 pick for all we know, there’s a possibility of him getting the backup role. It’s not like we have Nate here who refuses to play young guys and develop them. Bob Hill plays guys he sees as part of the future, and Brewer, if drafted here, could’ve been a major part.
As is, I’m not saying we should’ve drafted him over Sene, I agree with the premise of drafting big men every year.
July 17th, 2006 at 1:07 pm
“Your comment is awaiting moderation. ”
Can someone solve that ?
July 17th, 2006 at 1:09 pm
“To win ROY he’ll likely have to play starter’s minutes on the Jazz (most ROY winners start if not all) who have Harpring at the 2 and Kirilenko at the 3″
Harpring is not a 2
At the SG position I think the Jazz have just Giricek (who is always injured)
July 17th, 2006 at 1:19 pm
Gai in 7 preseason NBA games with more NBA players on the court
was under 3 pts 3 rebs in 16 minutes a game but 54% FG and blocked shots at the rate for 5 per 48 minutes. Rebounding rate was nothing special per minute. (Will watch Sene’s but give him time to adjust.)
Petro was only slightly better in preseason last year and Swift was much lower.
July 17th, 2006 at 1:27 pm
Swift was 1.2 pts 1.5 rebs in 9 minutes per preseason game in 6 games. Per 48 minutes closer to Petro and Gai. None anything special for any at that point. The real test of any player is in the regular season and after some time to learn & adjust.
I assume Sene will double Petro and Swift’s early block rates but will he match their end of the season rebounding rates right away or will that take 3 or more months to come on? I thought his scoring might be lower but first 2 summer games showed some promise there.
July 17th, 2006 at 1:27 pm
Merci beaucoup for the update on the French team Shawn!!!
July 17th, 2006 at 1:28 pm
De rien
July 17th, 2006 at 1:34 pm
France is playing this weekend but I will be in London so I won’t be able to give you live updates
July 17th, 2006 at 1:38 pm
“France is playing this weekend but I will be in London so I won’t be able to give you live updates”
Shawn lives a tough life…
July 17th, 2006 at 1:40 pm
July 17th, 2006 at 1:49 pm
You probably know this by now … but Bob Hill’s oldest son is named Cameron. He’s an assistant at Kentucky, and I saw him putting the big guys through drills, and he has tons of energy. He never stops talking, instructing. He actually seems like a better fit for this young team than Lewis or Schrempf.
Schnyd
July 17th, 2006 at 1:52 pm
“Griff Says:
July 17th, 2006 at 12:28 pm
It is a weakness right now… but thats because they are 20 years old and still suck! But ask a person like Pendergraft and they would be very interrested in our bigs because of their POTENTIAL to be great one day, not their stats last season. ”
— Although that is the perception here in Seattle are we sure that it is the same perception nationally? (not as important) Within the other FOs (much more important)? For example the Chandler/Curry front court was always looked at as a potential great combo. This made it much easier for the Bulls to basically get great deals for each of those players, because the other teams thought those players could be great. I just don’t see that with regards to our players
As I said in my previous post, I am not saying i agree with the perception of these guys. However, it may make it harder to trade them if necessary.
July 17th, 2006 at 1:57 pm
Gai is a free agent and perhaps will consider elsewhere.
Emmitt, Bobbitt Langford and Farmer and others didnt do anything notable last NBA preseason.
Utah has former Sonic summer leaguer and training camp invitee Roger Powell but not doing much this summer so far.
July 17th, 2006 at 2:00 pm
Utah’s CJ Miles is getting some favorable talk.
July 17th, 2006 at 2:28 pm
Schneider: If Bob Hill is successful this year with Seattle, my guess would be that Cameron Hill will be in the NBA next year. Coaches are a bit of a fraternity. Paul Silas’s son was on the staff with Paul at his last job; Donnie Nelson ditto; the guy just hired in Sacramento (can’t think of his name) is a NBA coaches son, and the list would probably go on if I did some research. Notice that Schrempf was reported to have signed on for ONE year as an assistant. It seems like this is more of a “toe in the water” deal for him. Cameron Hill makes his living as a coach, and I suspect he will get into the NBA soon; especially if Bob Hill is successful this year to the tune of 50 wins or so. Just my opinion.
Thanks for the insight on Frenchie Ball Shawn.
Joe
July 17th, 2006 at 3:28 pm
Fortson to Charlotte?
….Although the Bobcats figure to remain bit players in free agency, they could become the ultimate conduit in the coming season for teams attempting to broker cap-unfriendly deals. Charlotte presently stands about $7 million below the coming season’s cap minimum of $39.9 million, meaning that money has to be spent by season’s end. In other words, the Bobcats just might be willing to take a bad contract off a team’s hands for a first-round pick, or two, or. …
July 17th, 2006 at 3:30 pm
Bickerstaff’s son too. Hubie Brown’s son when he was in Memphis, Scott Layden, Larry Brown’s brother for awhile, D’antoni’s brother too.
July 17th, 2006 at 3:32 pm
TK, I am on vacation this week in Det. but I am based in Seattle. Nothing personal on Deng Gai just an opinion about him and b’ball in general.
I agree with you about the fact that he has potential and he did show it while in college which is great. My concern is his inability to deliver. 14 months out of college and still on the same pedestal as freshmen? C’mon.
July 17th, 2006 at 3:39 pm
What moves are coming for sonics? With this roster the sonics can make playoff the next season
July 17th, 2006 at 3:46 pm
Cameron Hill is officially Director of Player Development
http://tinyurl.com/py7nd
not officially one of three assistants
but it may be a technicality because of rules
July 17th, 2006 at 3:48 pm
Felix took two tries to land here. It is pretty common for borderline guys. But movin’ on.
July 17th, 2006 at 3:50 pm
New coach in Sacramento is Musselman.
July 17th, 2006 at 3:50 pm
So Brian is still in Utah today, right?
The Sonics game starts in 10 minutes.
July 17th, 2006 at 3:53 pm
Finally today I can sit and track the game from the updates, hopefully he’s still there.
July 17th, 2006 at 3:55 pm
The Schedule has the game at 7pm. I think Salt Lake City is an hour ahead so maybe 6pm. Did they adjust the schedule?
July 17th, 2006 at 3:55 pm
10 min? I thought we had a 6:00 game today?
July 17th, 2006 at 4:02 pm
San Antonio is 6 pm now, SLC 5pm, Seattle 4pm.
Game is 2 hours I believe. 7pm their local time
July 17th, 2006 at 4:03 pm
Anyone know if the US has made final cuts or if there is a final roster yet?
SLC is 1 hour ahead of us.
July 17th, 2006 at 4:04 pm
My bad. I thought the Sonics were the 5pm (local Utah) game today.
Anyway, Brian is already back in Seattle. So we’ll get no live updates
July 17th, 2006 at 4:07 pm
We could have hired Silas when we hired Westphal, what a debacle!
Also-does Watson get an honest shot at starting pg in camp? They didn’t fire Weiss until he benched Ridnour and started Wilkins…
July 17th, 2006 at 4:09 pm
Bummer…oh well, just have to wait for the box.
July 17th, 2006 at 4:14 pm
“Anyone know if the US has made final cuts or if there is a final
roster yet?”
They haven’t made the cuts yet. They are training in Vegas July 19-25 then again for a few days in the first couple days of August. Then I think they’ll make the preliminary cuts before they go to China/Korea for the exhibition games (Aug 6-16?).
July 17th, 2006 at 4:15 pm
Here’s the U.S. training/game schedule in case you are interested.
http://usabasketball.com/seniormen/2006/06_mwc_training_schedule.html
July 17th, 2006 at 4:21 pm
Thanks Kori, much appreciated!
July 17th, 2006 at 4:47 pm
“This made it much easier for the Bulls to basically get great deals for each of those players, because the other teams thought those players could be great. I just don’t see that with regards to our players.”
Great deals? LOL! PJ Brown and JR Smith for Chandler is a great deal only because it gets rid of Chandler’s long term contract. I wouldn’t exactly call that great return for a guy orginially drafted #2 overall…
Likewise they got a bunch of crap and picks in exchange for Curry solely because Isaiah was the only GM in the NBA dumb enough to give him that deal…I wouldn’t call that a great deal either, more like hitting the reset button.
Think of it this way, two years from now they are going to have a big steaming pile of jack squat and 2nd rd picks to show for the second and fourth pick in the 2001 draft … that scarcely deserves praise …
July 17th, 2006 at 4:59 pm
“I wouldn’t exactly call that great return for a guy orginially drafted #2 overall…”
Now lets call a spade a spade…
They dealt Elton Brand for PJ Brown, Howard Eisley (JR Smith was dealt again today), Brian Skinner and 2 second round picks!
July 17th, 2006 at 5:20 pm
“I wouldn’t call that a great deal either, more like hitting the reset button.”
Cap room to sign Wallace. Tyrus Thomas drafted this year and possibly Greg Oden next year. Not too shabby.
July 17th, 2006 at 5:39 pm
Umm I think we have our arguments messed up here. At what point did I say that Chandler and Curry were good? If they made a mistake and drafted those guys that is another issue. On top of that I think most people would trade Elton Brand and the #4 pick in a draft for:
- Ben Wallace (thanks to the cap space)
- PJ Brown (underrated veteran)
- JR Smith (young athlete who will probably be traded elsewhere)
- Tyrus Thomas (picked at #2 so that would seem to cancel out losing the #4)
- Possibly Greg Oden or whoever else is good in the great draft class of 2007.
I mean as I said before you can basically cancel one of them and Tyus Thomas out and although Chicago “might” regret not having Elton Brand anymore they are probably pretty happy with two veteran players and the possibility of drafting the best prospect since LeBron…
Now see Chicago was able to do a pretty good job getting out from under two young Cs that ended up being a mistake. On top of that both of those players have done more than any of our guys have done so far. If Sene/Petro/Swift end up not progressing do they have the same “potential” as Curry/Chandler? I just don’t see it based on some broad review of the national perspective. We keep talking about these guys being assets, but it seems like they are only assets to people who live in Seattle, which makes the trade market kind of slim.
July 17th, 2006 at 5:48 pm
Howard Eisley…what an odd trade. How is this guy still in the NBA? I usually only refer to him by his nick name: Gary Payton’s Biatch
July 17th, 2006 at 6:42 pm
“On top of that I think most people would trade Elton Brand and the #4 pick in a draft for:
- Ben Wallace (thanks to the cap space)
- PJ Brown (underrated veteran)
- JR Smith (young athlete who will probably be traded elsewhere)
- Tyrus Thomas (picked at #2 so that would seem to cancel out losing the #4)
- Possibly Greg Oden or whoever else is good in the great draft class of 2007.”
Elton Brand right now is the best player of the bunch. JR Smith’s already been dumped. Tyrus Thomas and the possibility of Greg Oden could have been had anyways.
I’d rather have Brand than Ben Wallace at this point. I think there’s a very good chance a year from now Wallace will be seen as an unmovable contract. But this is all just an opinion, nothing more.
“Howard Eisley…what an odd trade. How is this guy still in the NBA?”
Signed when Boykins went down right after they’d dealt Watson. Not sure how he’s still on the roster but he was nothing more than the filler which Chicago will immeadiately cut. They made that deal for the future second round picks and to free a roster spot for Adrian Griffin.
July 17th, 2006 at 6:53 pm
Myk-
While I think you are overstating the “return” on Chandler (you CAN’T say they got Ben Wallace for Chandler…that’s a gigantic leap), the Bulls certainly got a lot for Curry (Isaiah Thomas…a stupid, stupid man!!!).
HOWEVER…I think you are making an EXTREMELY valid point. Curry and Chandler always had more press and expected upside than Swift and Petro (particularly Petro). I HOPE that these guys continue to develop and are either great for Seattle or are valuable trade chips. However, I don’t think either have achieved that status yet, and we can’t just count on it.
Continued improvement from at least one of them (hopefully a giant leap!) is critical for Seattle’s long-term success.
July 17th, 2006 at 7:17 pm
“If Sene/Petro/Swift end up not progressing do they have the same “potential” as Curry/Chandler? I just don’t see it based on some broad review of the national perspective. We keep talking about these guys being assets, but it seems like they are only assets to people who live in Seattle, which makes the trade market kind of slim.”
Exactly. Curry and Chandler are not good players. Neither are Petro or Swift right now. We are all optimistic….but both have a long way to go to even be a poor mans Curry or Chandler. Its way too early. Nobody is licking their chops right now at the prospect of Swift or Petro being free agents anytime soon.
Realistically Swift/Petro are going to be like a Pryzbilla/Mihm/Nesterovic/Mohammed type player. Nothing they have done so far says anything different IMO. BTW: there is nothing wrong with them turning out to be like any of the above mentioned players, they are all average centers. I think about it this way…put Swift or Petro in college right now and do they dominate like Pryzbilla and Mihm did? I don’t think they do.
July 17th, 2006 at 10:01 pm
“Nothing they have done so far says anything different IMO.”
Just because they are 18-20 year olds who aren’t dominating doesn’t mean they are going to be a Mihm caliber player. That makes no sense.
They could easily be “average centers.”
It would be just like saying Kevin Garnett and Jermain O’Neal were realistically going to be average power forwards. It’s WAY to early to be projecting how good, bad, or average they are going to be.
And to be honest with you, I wouldn’t be surprised if they turn out to be average centers….BUT what did you want them to do in their first year or two in the league? ……..
July 17th, 2006 at 10:03 pm
“I just don’t see it based on some broad review of the national perspective. We keep talking about these guys being assets, but it seems like they are only assets to people who live in Seattle, which makes the trade market kind of slim.”
I’m not disagreeing with you. They may be viewed as complete stiffs around the league. HOWEVER, how would you know how other GMs around the league value Swift and Petro?
July 18th, 2006 at 4:26 am
Let the rest of the league sleep on what we got with these bigs! Man, let’s just win with them! Coach Hill is the right guy to manage young guys and with Coach Sikma we may be able to muster a front court to contend.
On the biz side- Petro might be the real leverage the FO has with Wilcox. Petro gets out on the break as quick or quicker than Wilcox and has more hops. With Sene and Swift at 5, moving Petro to 4 is natural.
Enough about the bigs, does Watson get a real shot at earning starting pg in camp?
July 18th, 2006 at 8:59 am
“On top of that both of those players have done more than any of our guys have done so far. ”
It’s clear to me by that sentence that you never watched Chandler and Curry play.
July 18th, 2006 at 9:00 am
“Realistically Swift/Petro are going to be like a Pryzbilla/Mihm/Nesterovic/Mohammed type player. ”
That’s better than Chandler or Curry.
July 18th, 2006 at 10:13 am
Adam,
— I agree with you and said that it would be impossible to quantify what the other GMs think about our players. However, public perception usually does at least an “OK” job of showing how other teams think of a player. Very rarely does a player get a big contract completely out of the blue.
Steve,
— You are kidding when you say that Chandler/Curry haven’t shown more in the NBA than Swift/Petro/Sene, right? I mean that could be more due to the fact that our three Cs haven’t played that many minutes.
However,
— If Petro could average: 7ppg, 7.7rpg, 1.4bpg, .5 spg and 50% shooting in only 24mpg I think we would be estatic. Obviously you can double those and get the p/48 stats that everyone likes
— If Swift could average: 12ppg, 5rpg, 1bpg and 54% shooting in only 24mpg I think most people would be happy (maybe he could bump up his rebounding stats)
As I am sure you can tell I am comparing Petro to Chandler and Swift to Curry (which seems logical based on the four players play style) and those numbers are Chandler and Curry’s career averages. They both had better years the last two.
So yes, as it stands now Curry and Chandler have completely outperformed any of our Cs. Could our guys get there? Yes. But to say they have already is just silly.
July 19th, 2006 at 2:06 pm
THANK GOD FOR NEW TEAM OWNERSHIP! I heard a rumor of it yesterday, and I checked the website and sure enough. It’ll be finalized just before October.
This is actually the most important off-season move…finding a good team of owners who will honor the lease. Buying both the Sonics and the Storm is encouraging too. Hopefully, we can make this a championship city with financially profitable teams.
I am pretty psyched about Sene and his abilities, however, at the same time, I hope that the team continues to build on a few more players with college experience and vets. I would argue that teams like Charlotte that have been built around guys with a lot of college experience (like Morrison, May, and Okefor) may be better prepared for the future than teams like Seattle. Ray Allen doesn’t have too many more years that he’ll be in his prime. Are we trying to win rings with him as our leader or not? That’s the only question that I have when I look at this last draft.
July 25th, 2006 at 9:57 pm
“DENG GAI”, didn’t this guy put a whole Fairfield basketball program on the map of college ball? I don’t know why people love to hate so much. This guy has not been given a real chance, it’s as simple as that. This is a guy who once had 19pts, 11rebs 13blocks in a single game. Deng Gai has a 7′5 wing span which makes him taller than he actually is. “GIVE THE GUY A REAL CHANCE TO PROVE YOU WRONG”
July 25th, 2006 at 10:02 pm
DENG GAI has some hidden treasure, i don’t care what anyone says. Give the guy a real chance.
July 26th, 2006 at 8:08 pm
Lets see, ” Deng Gai” is 6′9 240 has a 40inch vertical leap. He has a 7′5 wingspan and a 9′3 reach. The guy averaged 14pts, 8rebs and 5.6blocks per game in college. He was his conference three time defensive player of the year and lead the nation in blocked shots. He blocked 444 shots in college hoops putting him 8th on the all time list. Now he doesn’t have potential? You must be crazy if you think this guy is not gonna be something, i can see potential from a mile away.
May 17th, 2008 at 1:06 am
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